Guest Jeannie Wood Posted November 12, 2013 at 05:22 AM Report Share Posted November 12, 2013 at 05:22 AM We seem to have conflicting statements in our By-Laws: Roberts Rules of Order Newly Revised shall govern the proceedings of all Business Meetings of the Membership. A quorum for actions at the annual Business Meetings of the Membership shall consist of one-fifth (1/5) of the Members in good standing. The total numbers of Members present at a meeting and the number of absentee ballots shall be used to determine that a quorum exists. The debate is this: a) RRO says a quorum in all Business Meetings is based on the number of Members present at the meeting. Our By-Laws are being interpreted that the combination of "early/absentee" ballots AND the members present constitute a meeting quorum. Example, with 550 members, one-fifth quorum for a meeting is 110. The annual meeting then could have 100 absentee votes and 10 members present at the meeting and still be within the By-Laws. My argument is that the combination of absentee votes and members voting at the meeting is the quorum for voting; not the quorum for meetings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstackpo Posted November 12, 2013 at 10:58 AM Report Share Posted November 12, 2013 at 10:58 AM There is no such thing as a "quorum for voting". A quorum, per RONR, p. 345, is simply enough people (members, of course) present to do business at a meeting. In your case the bylaws supersede RONR, so you will have a quorum "present" when you combine the people physically present PLUS those absentee ballots, as long as that total meets or exceeds 1/5 of your membership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted November 12, 2013 at 03:52 PM Report Share Posted November 12, 2013 at 03:52 PM The debate is this: a) RRO says a quorum in all Business Meetings is based on the number of Members present at the meeting. Our By-Laws are being interpreted that the combination of "early/absentee" ballots AND the members present constitute a meeting quorum. Your bylaws take precedence over RONR. For the sake of clarity, it may be wise to amend the provision in your bylaws regarding the parliamentary authority to read "The rules contained in the current edition of Robert's Rules of Order Newly Revised shall govern the Society in all cases to which they are applicable and in which they are not inconsistent with these bylaws and any special rules of order the Society may adopt." I would note that RONR strongly advises against mixing and matching votes at a meeting with absentee votes. My argument is that the combination of absentee votes and members voting at the meeting is the quorum for voting; not the quorum for meetings. I don't buy that argument, and I'm not entirely sure what that distinction is supposed to mean. What would happen if a meeting did not have a quorum "for meeting" but had a quorum "for voting?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Edgar Posted November 12, 2013 at 04:44 PM Report Share Posted November 12, 2013 at 04:44 PM . . . you will have a quorum "present" when you combine the people physically present PLUS those absentee ballots, as long as that total meets or exceeds 1/5 of your membership. That seems like a reasonable interpretation of the rules cited but the rules seem to presuppose that there will be absentee ballots cast for all (or most) meetings and that seems unlikely. Further, absentee ballots might be cast for only one question but the meeting, having a "quorum", would be free to entertain additional motions (with, say, only ten members present). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Greg Posted November 12, 2013 at 05:03 PM Report Share Posted November 12, 2013 at 05:03 PM That seems like a reasonable interpretation of the rules cited but the rules seem to presuppose that there will be absentee ballots cast for all (or most) meetings and that seems unlikely. Further, absentee ballots might be cast for only one question but the meeting, having a "quorum", would be free to entertain additional motions (with, say, only ten members present). Yep, a ticklish, maybe even picklish situation... We see (one reason) why "...RONR strongly advises against mixing and matching votes at a meeting with absentee votes." (quoting Josh) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted November 12, 2013 at 05:08 PM Report Share Posted November 12, 2013 at 05:08 PM That seems like a reasonable interpretation of the rules cited but the rules seem to presuppose that there will be absentee ballots cast for all (or most) meetings and that seems unlikely. Further, absentee ballots might be cast for only one question but the meeting, having a "quorum", would be free to entertain additional motions (with, say, only ten members present). If the membership only has meetings annually (and the bylaws seem to suggest this is the case), I'm not sure it's that unlikely that absentee ballots will be cast for all (or most) meetings, although I agree on the second point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 14, 2013 at 04:23 AM Report Share Posted November 14, 2013 at 04:23 AM As long as the pickles don't sour. Thanks, all, for your feedback. I passed it on to our Board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ron Ernst Posted November 4, 2015 at 02:10 AM Report Share Posted November 4, 2015 at 02:10 AM Can unsigned absentee ballots be created by the hoa board to force an annual meeting quorum?Guest-Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstackpo Posted November 4, 2015 at 02:22 AM Report Share Posted November 4, 2015 at 02:22 AM Not unless the bylaws authorize the board to go into the counterfiting business. Seems quite unlikely. BTW, it is best if you start a new topic with a new question (even on a related subject). Easier to keep track that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Novosielski Posted November 5, 2015 at 02:56 AM Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 at 02:56 AM Can unsigned absentee ballots be created by the hoa board to force an annual meeting quorum?Guest-Ron You mean can the board create fake ballots? I think you know the answer to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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