Guest PHSC Posted August 26, 2015 at 01:21 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 01:21 PM During a recent club meeting, discussion ensued about the need to update our ByLaws.A committee was appointed by members volunteeringvia email from our Board president, I was appointed to Chair this committee. Our Board has one particular member who steers Board involvement, decisions, and activities by manipulation. I want to ensure that I can chair this committee through its assignment without interference from outside parties. Am I proposing to communicate a schedule outlining the process by which the committee with manage this task-- Section by Section. I am proposing a "Member Input" period followed by a "Committee Review" period for each segment of the ByLaws. Am I understanding Article IX (Committees and Boards), Section 52, Paragraph 2, that my strategy is the proper format for ensuring member input and at the same time protect the committee from outside influence until it is ready to submit its report.? It is my plan that the Committee will review member input, debate among ourselves and draft amendments to the ByLaws taking into consideration member input received. Present the Board a document (grid) showing current language, our official amendment, and how the new language would read if the amendment is approved. If we present this "report" containing multiple amendments, what is proper Board action? To handle each amendment separately, or to act upon our report as a whole? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted August 26, 2015 at 01:47 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 01:47 PM Am I understanding Article IX (Committees and Boards), Section 52, Paragraph 2, that my strategy is the proper format for ensuring member input and at the same time protect the committee from outside influence until it is ready to submit its report.?You're reading a very out-of-date version of Robert's Rules (it seems to be the 4th edition, published in 1915), but yes, this strategy seems fine.If we present this "report" containing multiple amendments, what is proper Board action? To handle each amendment separately, or to act upon our report as a whole?What does the board have to do with it? I thought this was a committee of the club.In any event, when the committee reports to its parent assembly, you could offer each amendment individually, or you could offer a single motion to adopt (or support) all of the proposed amendments. Even if you choose the latter option, however, a member could demand a separate vote on a particular amendment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted August 26, 2015 at 01:51 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 01:51 PM Agreeing with Mr. Martin, remember you can't dictate this stuff because you're chairing the committee. The committee itself needs to agree to hold a hearing and to agree how it will submit its report. The hearing (member input) is a very good idea, by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 26, 2015 at 03:07 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 03:07 PM Thank you all....by the way...If I'm quoting an outdated version....I got it from this site. I appreciate your insight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted August 26, 2015 at 03:19 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 03:19 PM Thank you all....by the way...If I'm quoting an outdated version....I got it from this site. No, the 1915 4th edition is not posted on this official Robert's Rules of Order website. You found it on another website with a deceptively similar name. We are now in the 11th edition published in 2011. I suggest strongly that you get it! http://www.robertsrules.com/book.html If you are truly new to Robert's Rules of Order, you might also get a copy of RONR in Brief: http://www.robertsrules.com/inbrief.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 26, 2015 at 04:07 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 04:07 PM It's on my shopping list! (perhaps even a Dummie's translation to complement the set.) Josh...when you ask "What does the Board have to do with it?" Please provide guidance. It is my understanding that the Board wants this committee to do the work, present recommendations for them to in turn review and present to the members. My fear is our work will stop with the Board. I want to ensure I have all "rules" in place to protect the interests of the members. If I can get guidance on which sections to have in my pocket. Thanks. I anticipate this will be a year-long process. bite by bite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Lages Posted August 26, 2015 at 04:34 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 04:34 PM Which body your committee will report to depends on which body actually created the committee. It's not completely clear from your original post which body that was.You say that the discussion took place "at a club meeting", so was the motion to create this committee made by the general membership at this club meeting? If so, then your committee report will be presented to the general membership and not the board. However, if the board actually created the committee then your report will be to them. Note that a committee reports to whichever body created it, regardless of the method used to appoint its members - which in your case appears to have been by the board president (via volunteers). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 26, 2015 at 06:32 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 06:32 PM I'm not totally new to Roberts Rules....I competed on a team in college. Just very rusty. As to who appointed this special committee...My guess is that if you read the minutes of the meeting, it wouldn't be clear either. A group being guided by someone who got in my face and told me to "read the rules" who probably doesn't even own a copy. So. I'll place "nice" but do my homework. I am glad to have this forum to guide my thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted August 26, 2015 at 06:35 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 06:35 PM As to who appointed this special committee...My guess is that if you read the minutes of the meeting, it wouldn't be clear either.Well, was it a meeting of the membership or a meeting of the board? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted August 26, 2015 at 07:23 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 07:23 PM It's on my shopping list! (perhaps even a Dummie's translation to complement the set.)If you are referring to "Robert's Rules for Dummies" by C. Alan Jennings, I recommend it highly. Mr. Jennings is a well respected professional registered parliamentarian and it is an excellent book which is true to RONR. Keep in mind, though, that it is not a substitute for RONR, but rather a supplement to RONR which can be of great help in understanding it. So, if you can afford roughly $35 for the three books from Amazon, I recommend the three we have discussed: RONR, which is THE authority and you need if you are going to be drafting bylaws and doing anything other than the basics; RONR in Brief which is an excellent basic primer for those who are completely new to Robert's Rules; and Robert's Rules For Dummies for help understanding some of the more complex provisions of RONR. Each book serves a purpose. btw, RONR has an excellent chapter on the content, composition and amendment of bylaws as well as well-written sample bylaws. Robert's Rules for Dummies is also helpful in this regard. RONR in Brief does not get into drafting bylaws or bylaw amendments. The National Association of Parliamentarians (NAP) also has several books and pamphlets on bylaws which you might find helpful. From the home page, click on "Store" on the bar at the top to see what they have available: http://www.parliamentarians.org/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted August 26, 2015 at 07:49 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 07:49 PM The National Association of Parliamentarians (NAP) also has several books and pamphlets on bylaws which you might find helpful. From the home page, click on "Store" on the bar at the top to see what they have available: http://www.parliamentarians.org/ Also, no organization on the planet actually processes more bylaw amendments than NAP. So they have a lot of practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Honemann Posted August 26, 2015 at 07:56 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 07:56 PM Also, no organization on the planet actually processes more bylaw amendments than NAP. So they have a lot of practice. Well, they have to have something to do at their conventions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:18 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:18 PM Also, no organization on the planet actually processes more bylaw amendments than NAP. So they have a lot of practice. Well, they have to have something to do at their conventions.Yep. 22 of em at next week's convention... 47 pages worth!! 42 amendments if you count the "conforming amendments". I think we will be busy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:27 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:27 PM Yep. 22 of em at next week's convention... 47 pages worth!! 42 amendments if you count the "conforming amendments". I think we will be busy. Assuming there aren't 25 or so amendments to the proposed convention standing rules, like there usually are, you might even get them all done. I can't be there but have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ann Rempel Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:38 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:38 PM Well, they have to have something to do at their conventions. Yeah, and poor me; I have to write the minutes. I fear reaching a new length of 50 pages or so! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:47 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:47 PM Well, was it a meeting of the membership or a meeting of the board?It was a meeting of the membership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:50 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 08:50 PM Yeah, and poor me; I have to write the minutes. I fear reaching a new length of 50 pages or so! Back when I competed. I was the secretary. The whole competition was timed, including the allowance to compose the minutes. The typewriter ribbon broke as I sat along in the room in a panic.I notified the moderator, the equipment was fixed and I still beat the bell. We got 2nd place! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Guest Posted August 26, 2015 at 09:17 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 09:17 PM As to who appointed this special committee...My guess is that if you read the minutes of the meeting, it wouldn't be clear either. Well, was it a meeting of the membership or a meeting of the board? It was a meeting of the membership. Then it's very likely a committee of the membership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted August 26, 2015 at 10:14 PM Report Share Posted August 26, 2015 at 10:14 PM Then it's very likely a committee of the membership.Which means that the committee likely reports to the membership, not to the board, unless it was specifically instructed to make its report to the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shmuel Gerber Posted August 27, 2015 at 04:15 AM Report Share Posted August 27, 2015 at 04:15 AM Yep. 22 of em at next week's convention... 47 pages worth!! 42 amendments if you count the "conforming amendments". I think we will be busy. Next week, yikes! I'd better start rehearsing my speech for why they shouldn't snatch away my PRP credentials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shmuel Gerber Posted August 27, 2015 at 04:17 AM Report Share Posted August 27, 2015 at 04:17 AM Yeah, and poor me; I have to write the minutes. I fear reaching a new length of 50 pages or so! Then maybe it's time for NAP to start complying with the rules in RONR for how minutes should be composed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ann Rempel Posted August 27, 2015 at 04:51 AM Report Share Posted August 27, 2015 at 04:51 AM Then maybe it's time for NAP to start complying with the rules in RONR for how minutes should be composed? So you have been reading the minutes in your spare time? Maybe I can get you appointed to the approval committee as a reward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weldon Merritt Posted August 27, 2015 at 05:02 AM Report Share Posted August 27, 2015 at 05:02 AM Yeah, and poor me; I have to write the minutes. I fear reaching a new length of 50 pages or so! Not to mention helping the bylaws committee make sure all of the adopted amendments get properly incorporated into the final copy of the bylaws! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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