Chuck Culver Posted June 23, 2017 at 03:28 PM Report Share Posted June 23, 2017 at 03:28 PM If the Board has 16 members, and the basis for determining a majority under the bylaws is "majority of voting members present" and all 16 members are present, may the chair vote to create a majority when the vote is 8 for, 6 against, and one abstention? The chair's vote will not break or cause a tie, but can affect the determination of a majority. RONR states on p. 406: "Similarly, the chair's vote might affect the result in cases where a majority of the members can decide a question", but provides no further explanation or context. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Goodwiller, PRP Posted June 23, 2017 at 03:40 PM Report Share Posted June 23, 2017 at 03:40 PM First of all, I think the wording "voting members present" is open to some interpretation - and frankly, I would recommend changing it. RONR's default understanding would be "members present and voting;" in which case the majority changes depending on how many abstain. But, assuming your interpretation that if 16 "voting members" (meaning, I guess, members who are allowed to vote, whether or not they choose to do so), then yes, in your scenario the chair could vote to create a majority. The beginning of the section you quote states that "the presiding officer, if a member of the assembly, can (but is not obliged to) vote whenever his vote will affect the result" (RONR p. 405, ll. 21-23). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Culver Posted June 23, 2017 at 03:48 PM Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2017 at 03:48 PM This is helpful. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kim Goldsworthy Posted June 24, 2017 at 03:17 PM Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 at 03:17 PM 23 hours ago, Chuck Culver said: [...] the basis for determining a majority under the bylaws is "majority of voting members present" [...] I have not read your bylaws. But when that phrase is used, it usually implies that there is a class of membership which cannot vote. Q. Does your organization have a class of membership which is defined as having "no vote"? If yes, then your "majority" rule is to be interpreted as implying, "Exclude the class of members who are not empowered to vote when counting ____ ." (a majority, or a quorum, etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintCad Posted June 25, 2017 at 08:49 AM Report Share Posted June 25, 2017 at 08:49 AM Question for the OP - are you talking about a majority (more than 50%) or a 2/3 majority? If just a majority is needed 8 to 6 with one abstention is already a majority and the motion will pass no matter what the Chair does. If a 2/3 majority is needed then yes the Chair can vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted June 25, 2017 at 03:55 PM Report Share Posted June 25, 2017 at 03:55 PM On 6/23/2017 at 10:28 AM, Chuck Culver said: If the Board has 16 members, and the basis for determining a majority under the bylaws is "majority of voting members present" and all 16 members are present, may the chair vote to create a majority when the vote is 8 for, 6 against, and one abstention? The chair's vote will not break or cause a tie, but can affect the determination of a majority. RONR states on p. 406: "Similarly, the chair's vote might affect the result in cases where a majority of the members can decide a question", but provides no further explanation or context. I think it is necessary for your organization to interpret its own bylaws to determine whether the intent of the voting requirement is a regular "majority vote", which is a majority of those members present and voting, or "the vote of a majority of the members present". Those two requirements are not at all the same. Then, as others have mentioned, if your board has both voting and non voting members, you have to factor that in and determine for yourselves exactly what it means. Your bylaws use non-standard language in establishing the vote requirement, so your organization must interpret its own rule. You might read pages 400-406 of RONR for the preferred language of different vote requirements and the meanings of different phraseology. Any time you deviate from the norm, even slightly, you create problems such as the one you have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Novosielski Posted June 25, 2017 at 05:20 PM Report Share Posted June 25, 2017 at 05:20 PM 8 hours ago, SaintCad said: Question for the OP - are you talking about a majority (more than 50%) or a 2/3 majority? If just a majority is needed 8 to 6 with one abstention is already a majority and the motion will pass no matter what the Chair does. If a 2/3 majority is needed then yes the Chair can vote. The phrase "2/3 majority" is not to be found in RONR. A motion may require a majority vote, or a 2/3 vote, but not both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted June 26, 2017 at 06:09 PM Report Share Posted June 26, 2017 at 06:09 PM On 6/25/2017 at 3:49 AM, SaintCad said: Question for the OP - are you talking about a majority (more than 50%) or a 2/3 majority? If just a majority is needed 8 to 6 with one abstention is already a majority and the motion will pass no matter what the Chair does. If a 2/3 majority is needed then yes the Chair can vote. The OP is talking about a situation where the rules require a vote of a majority of the members present, and there are sixteen members present. In such a case, nine votes in the affirmative will be required to adopt a motion. So if there is a vote of 8 to 6, the chair may vote in the affirmative if he wishes to do so. I concur with the other posters that it is ambiguous whether the organization's rules do, in fact, require a vote of a majority of the members present, and that it will be up to the organization to make this determination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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