"Create Account"?

[Guest Edgar]

I just noticed the green "Create Account" button at the upper right corner of the page. Is this new? If so, it seems a bit more ominous (and financial?) than, say, "Become a Member" or "Join Us".

[Dan Honemann]

I just noticed the green "Create Account" button at the upper right corner of the page. Is this new? If so, it seems a bit more ominous (and financial?) than, say, "Become a Member" or "Join Us".

I agree, but I don't think that this is something over which we have any control. You'll have to ask the boss lady.

[Boss Lady]

Hi Edgar. If you are using the forum as a guest, then there is a "Create Account" button on the top right corner as you say. This is a purchased forum product that we are using. There are many things that we can do to customize it, but we cannot control the labels on the buttons. There is no charge for membership and it certainly isn't meant to be ominous. Membership is entirely optional.

[Ann Rempel]

I often see "Create an Account" buttons on websites for discussions or for maintaining a membership profile. I think most "guests" will know how to deal with it.

[Rev Ed]

To be honest, I never understood why you haven't created an account here Edgar. It's free as mentioned above.

[Guest Edgar]

I agree, but I don't think that this is something over which we have any control. You'll have to ask the boss lady.

Thanks. It may very well have been there all the time and I only just noticed it. I also noticed that, when you click on "Create Account" and read the Terms of Use, you're asked to ("simply") click the "Register" button. But of course there is no "Register" button, only the "Create Account" button.

[Guest Edgar]

I think most "guests" will know how to deal with it.

I think most guests deal with it by remaining guests.

[Guest Edgar]

To be honest, I never understood why you haven't created an account here Edgar. It's free as mentioned above.

To be honest, I became a member (though I guess the proper term now is "created an account") on Day One (aka 19-May 10). Sometime after that I developed a perverse aversion to the CAPTCHA code (about which I've pledged to say no more).

[Guest Edgar]

This is a purchased forum product that we are using. There are many things that we can do to customize it, but we cannot control the labels on the buttons.

Thanks. And I certainly don't mean to place any of the blame on you. I'm sure you have better things to do. It's just that I've had a little experience with such "open source" (i.e. free) options as phpBB (that are completely customizable) that I scratch my head when you have less control over something you're actually paying for.

But, since I've got your attention, isn't the choice of CAPTCHA code one of the things you can change? For example, changing it to what I think is the IPBoard default of Re-CAPTCHA?

Sorry for the rant. And on such a nice day as we're having here in the Northeast, it's especially egregious.

[Dan Honemann]

To be honest, I became a member (though I guess the proper term now is "created an account") on Day One (aka 19-May 10). Sometime after that I developed a perverse aversion to the CAPTCHA code (about which I've pledged to say no more).

As to the captcha code, you may wish to note that just this morning, in a weak moment, I asked the boss lady to take it down one notch just to give it another try. She did, and within the space of about five to ten minutes we had two spam messages that I had to delete. Forget it.

[Shmuel Gerber]

As to the captcha code, you may wish to note that just this morning, in a weak moment, I asked the boss lady to take it down one notch just to give it another try. She did, and within the space of about five to ten minutes we had two spam messages that I had to delete. Forget it.

So what? At that rate, you'd have to delete only about 300-500 spam messages a day. To paraphrase the Little Orphan Annie, you gotta earn your keep. :-)

[Dan Honemann]

So what? At that rate, you'd have to delete only about 300-500 spam messages a day. To paraphrase the Little Orphan Annie, you gotta earn your keep. :-)

Boss lady, could you please sit on the rotten little kid?

[Gary c Tesser]

.... :-)

RONR, 11th Ed, says you have a degree in computer science. Do you agree that the website's only choice is between the current spam filter, which (to a statistical certainty, I'm confident) keeps out people who want to ask questions on what should be the world's premier Internet parliamentary forum, but who find the filter impenetrable; and one so porous as to allow in dozens or hundreds of spams an hour?

I think it's a false choice. Maybe five or so years ago, but not now. I appreciate Mr Honemann's effort at generosity, which uncharitably if characteristically modestly he describes as a weak moment, but ratcheting back the already demonstrably unsatisfactory system is not the way to fix it. Nobody wants to increase his load of tedious chores, and nobody is proposing a solution that would. Nor, for that matter, increasing the load of tedious chores (or interesting chores) for Her (Boss) Ladyship (Ms Evans). But if an old and decrepit guy like Guest Edgar (or I) can stumble his senescent way towards finding some spam filters that do the job, easily, on all counts (and have probably been available for half a decade, with only improvements made in the interim), then please don't ask me to believe that you actually think that the current obnoxious system is the best we can do.

[Shmuel Gerber]

RONR, 11th Ed, says you have a degree in computer science. Do you agree that the website's only choice is between the current spam filter, which (to a statistical certainty, I'm confident) keeps out people who want to ask questions on what should be the world's premier Internet parliamentary forum, but who find the filter impenetrable; and one so porous as to allow in dozens or hundreds of spams an hour? ...

Actually, there is a CAPTCHA that displays a set of pictures of dogs and cats, and you're supposed to select just the cats (or the dogs). But some of those cats really look like dogs! Or maybe the dogs look like cats. Anyway, the system works because the dogs eat the spam, and everyone is happy.

[Dan Honemann]

RONR, 11th Ed, says you have a degree in computer science. Do you agree that the website's only choice is between the current spam filter, which (to a statistical certainty, I'm confident) keeps out people who want to ask questions on what should be the world's premier Internet parliamentary forum, but who find the filter impenetrable; and one so porous as to allow in dozens or hundreds of spams an hour?

I think it's a false choice. Maybe five or so years ago, but not now. I appreciate Mr Honemann's effort at generosity, which uncharitably if characteristically modestly he describes as a weak moment, but ratcheting back the already demonstrably unsatisfactory system is not the way to fix it. Nobody wants to increase his load of tedious chores, and nobody is proposing a solution that would. Nor, for that matter, increasing the load of tedious chores (or interesting chores) for Her (Boss) Ladyship (Ms Evans). But if an old and decrepit guy like Guest Edgar (or I) can stumble his senescent way towards finding some spam filters that do the job, easily, on all counts (and have probably been available for half a decade, with only improvements made in the interim), then please don't ask me to believe that you actually think that the current obnoxious system is the best we can do.

After I asked the boss lady to try once again to simplify the CAPTCHA she responded:

"I changed the CAPTCHA style to "reCAPTCHA" which is the more common type of CAPTCHA. Hopefully this won't cause any problems."

When, unfortunately, it immediately did cause problems, and we received two awful spam messages within a very few minutes, we switched back because, as the boss lady then advised me:

"They only offer two styles of CAPTCHA with a few different color choices for each, so we do not have very many options. I know people don't like this style of CAPTCHA, but they would dislike the spam more. It is the lesser of two evils."

Since you and Guest Edgar are so much better informed, I suggest you correspond directly with the boss lady and get her all straightened out.

[George Mervosh]

So what? At that rate, you'd have to delete only about 300-500 spam messages a day. To paraphrase the Little Orphan Annie, you gotta earn your keep. :-)

Please stop harassing the "Staff".

[Boss Lady]

Edgar, you are welcome to write to me if you want to discuss CAPTCHA, Creating Accounts, or any other topic as Dan suggests. Granted, I do not always come on the forum to see what everyone is saying about me but I will try to make a point of coming on more frequently.

I absolutely agree with you that the form of CAPTCHA that we use is not very user friendly. Unfortunately, we only have two styles to chose from and the other style is apparently extremely user friendly for the spammers. As Dan mentioned, he suggested I swtich to reCAPTCHA and I was barely finished making the change when he emailed me to let me know he was already having do delete spam. I wish we could get rid of it all together, but if we did you would have to sift through hundreds of spam messages looking for real messages.

You suggested that the forum is open source and we should be able to change anything we want. That may be theoretically the case, but unfortunately we do not have a staff of website developers to dig into the code. We do our best with the resources we have available (namely me and Dan). The software provides extensive opportunities to customize the forum and we do what we can to make it suit our needs. Overall, I think the sotware has been excellent. There may be a few small things that some members object to (and other members may like). I am open to any thoughts you have about how we could better customize it. Of course, all decisions go through Dan who is the true boss man.

[Shmuel Gerber]

Please stop harassing the "Staff".

OK. But just so you know, the stuff about the dogs and the cats is real. (Well, except for the part about the dogs eating the Spam.)

[Ann Rempel]

OK. But just so you know, the stuff about the dogs and the cats is real. (Well, except for the part about the dogs eating the Spam.)

No animal should have to eat Spam. Ugh.

[Gary c Tesser]

Good to see Ann Rempel getting out more. I worry about her sometimes cooped up at home pecking at the computer all day instead of out here with us free spirits in the fresh air.