Closed a Executive meetings/ right to vote vote?

[Tom]

My Union President likes to call closed meeting several times during our annual open Union meetings.  The problem is that he doesn't use procedure and just says they need members to leave so they can have a closed meeting... No motion or second by any of the board.  The meeting usually take place because the President and board don't know what they're doing and I assume they're trying no to embarrass themselves.  

This last incident for a closed meeting occurred when we had an employee left our company for 12 days but returned because the other job did not became what it was supposed to.  He  was never taken out of our company system, like he never left, and union dues were still being taken out of pay checks.  The company is okay with giving him his seven years of seniority back but a the union, Officers, will not.    

The President ordered a closed meeting and kicked out all members from the meeting. Three minutes later the meeting opened up again and the employee was told the that the board voted and will not allow him to have his seniority back.

Question 1: are there any updates on Par Law and its stance of closed meetings or the abuse of them.

Question 2: who has the right to vote on said issue?  Does the Executive board have control of the voting and how they choose to vote (by union or executive) or is it the right of the Union member to be able to vote on issues like this?

I have read and researched about these issues and found that there is nothing specific about this type of voting privileges; who gets to vote on what and who decides that.  I also found that Par Law doesn't really care for closed meetings but I'm unsure if things have changed since 2007, the latest version I had access too.

Thanks for reading. 

Edited January 22, 2018 at 08:41 PM by Tom

[Joshua Katz]

1. Most likely, your organization has adopted RONR, not Parliamentary Law, and so those are the rules you must follow.  Executive sessions require a majority vote.  However, in some jurisdictions there are applicable statutes. 

2. The assembly which is meeting may vote on a motion for an executive session.  If the board is meeting, then the board may vote.  If the membership is meeting, then the membership may vote.  However, check your bylaws, any applicable provisions in the parent organization's bylaws, and any applicable statutes.

[Tom]

You'e correct, we use RONR.

We have nothing in out by-laws about  closed executive session during out open annual meetings. I think it's just one of those things that the current Officers seen the past ones do and continued it...this is the theme with most things they do.  I have to remind them that they'e not following procedure and must follow by-laws and our Constitution.  The never learn.

I will have to inject myself for a point of clarification at our next meeting, however I doubt it will help.

 

Thank you for your wisdom.

Edited January 22, 2018 at 09:13 PM by Tom

[Bruce Lages]

An important question that needs to be answered first is whose meetings are you talking about? You mentioned 'our annual open union meetings' - are these meetings of the union general membership, or meetings of the union executive board that general members are permitted to attend?

If these are scheduled meetings of the general union membership, then it certainly would not be appropriate for the president to be calling for a meeting of the executive board - whether in executive (closed) session or not -  in the middle of a general membership meeting. In such a case, a point of order should be raised that the president has no authority to unilaterally convert the meeting into an executive board meeting.

If these are executive board meetings that the membership is permitted to attend, then the president may be within his rights to ask for a closed session, excluding any nonmembers. Whether this can be done or not will most likely depend on the wording of your bylaws regarding the rights of general members to attend executive board meetings

[Josh Martin]

1 hour ago, Tom said:

Question 1: are there any updates on Par Law and its stance of closed meetings or the abuse of them.

The board is free to meet in executive session whenever it wishes, unless your organization’s rules or applicable law provide otherwise.

I don’t think the rules on this subject have changed in any significant way.

1 hour ago, Tom said:

Question 2: who has the right to vote on said issue? Does the Executive board have control of the voting and how they choose to vote (by union or executive) or is it the right of the Union member to be able to vote on issues like this?

What issue? Whether the board shall enter executive session? In that event, the board certainly has “control of the voting and how they choose to vote.”

If you are referring to to the substantive issues involving the employee, which body has the authority to decide that issue has more to do with your rules (and possibly applicable law) than with RONR.

1 hour ago, Tom said:

I also found that Par Law doesn't really care for closed meetings

Where do you get this idea? My reading of RONR is that it is neutral on the subject of whether an assembly should meet in executive session.

1 hour ago, Tom said:

but I'm unsure if things have changed since 2007, the latest version I had access too.

What book are you reading? There was no edition of Robert’s Rules of Order published in 2007. Make sure you have The Right Book.

In any event, the rules on this subject have not changed recently.

1 hour ago, Joshua Katz said:

1. Most likely, your organization has adopted RONR, not Parliamentary Law, and so those are the rules you must follow.

I suspect the OP is using the term “parliamentary law” to refer to parliamentary procedure generally, not to the text with that title by General Robert.

Edited January 22, 2018 at 10:26 PM by Josh Martin

[Guest Who's Coming to Dinner]

2 hours ago, Tom said:

I have read and researched about these issues and found that there is nothing specific about this type of voting privileges; who gets to vote on what and who decides that. 

The fundamental principle is that anyone who is a member of the body which is meeting has the right to vote. As Mr. Lages inquires, we must know whether this is a meeting of the board or a meeting of the union membership. It cannot be both.