Motion to rescind

[Guest John Higgins]

Several years ago my local government approved an action. It turns out this action violates our town charter. What is the proper way for the government to rescind or repeal this action?

[jstackpo]

If you local govt. uses RONR (not likely) the "rescind" is the motion to use.

Otherwise you are on your own - ask a lawyer - "repeal", perhaps?

[hmtcastle]

If you local govt. uses RONR (not likely) the "rescind" is the motion to use.

Otherwise you are on your own - ask a lawyer - "repeal", perhaps?

I would think all that's required is a point of order stating that the motion conflicts with the town charter and a ruling that it's therefore null and void. Rescinding or "repealing" it would seem to grant it a legitimacy is doesn't deserve.

[jstackpo]

Although I'll bet the mess ends up in court.

[Dan Honemann]

Although I'll bet the mess ends up in court.

Then all's right with the world.

[Guest Jack Simmerman]

If you local govt. uses RONR (not likely) the "rescind" is the motion to use.

Otherwise you are on your own - ask a lawyer - "repeal", perhaps?

Actually, in my state RONR is the most common parliamentary authority cited for most local governmental units.

[jstackpo]

Perhaps my judgment is clouded by my New England ("Town Meeting Time") background.

[Guest guest]

Can a point of order be made even though the original motion passed several years ago?

I would think all that's required is a point of order stating that the motion conflicts with the town charter and a ruling that it's therefore null and void. Rescinding or "repealing" it would seem to grant it a legitimacy is doesn't deserve.

[J. J.]

Can a point of order be made even though the original motion passed several years ago?

Yes, as per page 244.

Dr. Stackpole, RONR is commonly used either by adoption or by custom in local governments.

[Guest marqsfg]

A vote to deny was approved. I believe one member did not realize that he was voting to deny. Can the vote be reconsidered? The Commission has not met since the vote. If not, can the vote be rescinded? If so, how can that be done?

[hmtcastle]

A vote to deny was approved. I believe one member did not realize that he was voting to deny. Can the vote be reconsidered? The Commission has not met since the vote. If not, can the vote be rescinded? If so, how can that be done?

It's too late for a motion to reconsider.

It may not be too late for a motion to rescind. But note that rescinding a "motion to deny" will not result in approval.

it would have been better to defeat a motion to approve than to approve a motion to deny. Much less confusing

[Guest guest]

Can you provide the relevent text on page 244? I don't have a copy of RONR.

Yes, as per page 244.

Dr. Stackpole, RONR is commonly used either by adoption or by custom in local governments.

[Chris Harrison]

Can you provide the relevent text on page 244? I don't have a copy of RONR.

RONR p. 244 says:

The only exceptions to the rule that a point of order must be made at the time of the breach arise in connection with breaches that are of a continuing nature, in which case a point of order can be made at any time during the continuance of the breach. Instances of this kind occur when:

(a) a main motion has been adopted that conflicts with the bylaws (or constitution) of the organization or assembly,*

For RONR's purposes the Town Charter would be equivalent to bylaws or a constitution.

The asterisk is indicating a footnote which says:

*Unless the conflict is with a rule in the nature of a rule of order as described on page 17, lines 22-24, in which case a point of order must be timely.

RONR p. 17 lines 22-24 says:

Rules clearly identifiable as in the nature of rules of order that are placed within the bylaws can also be suspended by a two-thirds vote;

[Trina]

Several years ago my local government approved an action. It turns out this action violates our town charter. What is the proper way for the government to rescind or repeal this action?

Can you provide the relevent text on page 244? I don't have a copy of RONR.

I would point out that the relevance of p. 244(a) here does depend on the relationship of the 'town charter' to the 'local government' that approved the violating action. The p. 244(a) reference applies if the charter is equivalent to the bylaws of that local government body. Although that seems likely to be the case, I'm not 100% sure from the way the original poster described the situation. If the approved action is in violation of some higher-level (non-procedural) statute, then p. 244 would not apply.

[J. J.]

RONR p. 244 says:

For RONR's purposes the Town Charter would be equivalent to bylaws or a constitution.

The asterisk is indicating a footnote which says:

RONR p. 17 lines 22-24 says:

Chris, because this a town charter, I'm not sure that p. 17 l. 22-24 would apply.

[Josh Martin]

Chris, because this a town charter, I'm not sure that p. 17 l. 22-24 would apply.

I agree. "Similarly, no applicable procedural rule prescribed by federal, state, or local law can be suspended unless the rule specifically provides for its own suspension." (RONR, 10th ed., pg. 254, line 34 - pg. 255, line 2) While the town charter may be in the nature of Bylaws for the local government, it is also a local law.

[alanh49]

Several years ago my local government approved an action. It turns out this action violates our town charter. What is the proper way for the government to rescind or repeal this action?

You should have your attorney check and see if the action taken was authorized by a state or federal law that would supersede the charter.

[Guest marqsfg]

It's too late for a motion to reconsider.

It may not be too late for a motion to rescind. But note that rescinding a "motion to deny" will not result in approval.

it would have been better to defeat a motion to approve than to approve a motion to deny. Much less confusing

[Guest marqsfg]

I realize that rescinding a motion to deny will not result in approval. I'm assuming that it would just bring it back up for another vote. Roberts states that the motion to rescind would need a majority vote if in the call of the meeting. Does this mean if it is on the agenda? It also says it needs a 2/3 vote without notice, or by a majority of the entire membership. That last one confuses me. It is a 7 person Commission. If it is not on the agenda, would we need a 2/3 vote, or a simple majority?

[hmtcastle]

I realize that rescinding a motion to deny will not result in approval. I'm assuming that it would just bring it back up for another vote.

No, you'd have to make another motion to bring it up for another vote.

Roberts states that the motion to rescind would need a majority vote if in the call of the meeting. Does this mean if it is on the agenda? It also says it needs a 2/3 vote without notice, or by a majority of the entire membership. That last one confuses me. It is a 7 person Commission. If it is not on the agenda, would we need a 2/3 vote, or a simple majority?

Don't confuse the agenda with the call of a meeting.

If previous notice of the motion to rescind is given (either at the preceding meeting or in the notice of the next meeting), you'll only need a majority vote. If such previous notice is not given, you'll need either a two-thirds vote or the vote of a majority of the entire membership.

For a committee with seven members, four votes would constitute a vote of a majority of the entire membership. But a vote of 1-0 would constitute a two-thirds vote (as well as a majority vote).

[Guest Arthur541]

Several years ago my local government approved an action. It turns out this action violates our town charter. What is the proper way for the government to rescind or repeal this action?

[Robert B Fish]

In the future, please start a new topic for a new thread as this!

If the action violates the city charter, it is null and void [p244, RONR (10th ed.)]. Any member can raise a point of order at the nexty meeting that the prior motion violates the city charter. The chairman will then declare that the action is null and void and that will be that. The council can go through the steps of rescinding the motion if your attorney feels that is needed. For the typical society that action is not needed but your situation might differ. Ask your attorney.

-Bob