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mjhmjh

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Posts posted by mjhmjh

  1. My organization only meets twice a year. To accommodate the unique needs of each biannual meeting, the by-laws state that "the Secretary must propose special rules of order for each biannual meeting." Adopting special rules of order normally requires a 2/3 vote and notice. However, since the by-laws require that he or she propose special rules of order, need the Secretary give notice? Additionally, can notice for special rules of order merely summarize the proposed special rules of order, rather than include their exact text?

  2. Say the officers of an organization are a president, vice-president, secretary, and treasurer, listed in that order in the by-laws and, per RONR, elected in that order. However, following several rounds of balloting for vice-president, it becomes clear that the vice-presidential election will take much longer than expected, posing the risk that quorum will be lost (as members leave as the night drags on) before the last two elections can take place. Would it be in order to suspend the rules and elect the secretary and treasurer before the vice-president?

  3. 51 minutes ago, Guest Nancy N, said:

    Why do you mention this?  Is this your first meeting, or are you looking at nuances with respect to memorizing The Book to be ready for your RP test, like I?

    (I'm giving up on this substantive question; but I'd please appreciate feedback on the Note Bene, below.  Sure, it's ultra vires, but I hazard no more than was my breezily chatting about dating supermodels in a thread about suspending bylaws.  You all remember that one..)

    ___________

    Nota bene for my fellow nerds: is "like I" proper, since it's short for "as I am"?

    (O, let's not shut down the Internet on this.  -- at least without Dr Seabold looking in, to see how well we're dong wi)

    Mention what?

  4. Just now, Richard Brown said:

    Perhaps someone from the authorship team will elaborate, but it is my understanding that the rule that a majority vote is required to elect someone to office comes from the common parliamentary law and predates even General Robert's first book on rules of order in 1876.  Other commonly used parliamentary authorities, such as the AIP Standard Code of Parliamentary Procedure (previously known as "Sturgis") and Demeter's Manual of Parliamentary Law and Procedure require it.   It's not just an RONR rule.

    I meant why does RONR simply require another round of voting, rather than removing the candidate receiving the fewest votes?

  5. On 7/21/2017 at 10:57 AM, Richard Brown said:

     

    I just realized that although the most recent post was made this morning, this thread was actually started March 12 by mjhmjh.  However, the statement above about regular meetings needing to be scheduled by resolution concerns me enough that I want to comment on it.

    I hope there is some other way to schedule regular meetings and I hope there is a way to call special meetings.  If not, this organization may find itself without any means of scheduling a regular meeting if, for example, it adjourns a regular meeting without having set the date for the next meeting or if a meeting is canceled due to bad weather.   Perhaps the board has the authority to schedule meetings of the membership. 

    mjhmjh, if you are still around, I would appreciate it if you would try to clear this up.

    The bylaws address this. I've added the relevant sections of the meeting article for your reading. Outside of this article, the executive board has the power to "adjust the hour and place of meetings." Annotations are bolded and in brackets

    ARTICLE VI — Meetings

    Section 1. Regular Meetings. The regular meetings of the Council shall be held at least once per month, excluding the months of June and July, as scheduled by resolution at least 21 days in advance. Upon the passage of such a resolution, the Secretary shall immediately distribute it to as much of the membership as is possible. A Rotarian shall be present at all regular meetings of the Council [requirement by higher organization]. If no future meetings are scheduled by resolution, the Council shall meet at the call of the Governor [equivalent to president] or highest-ranking officer.

    Section 3. Special Meetings. Special meetings may be called by the Council, Governor, or Executive Board and shall be called upon the written request of 10% of the membership. The purpose of the meeting shall be included in the call, which shall be sent to as much of the membership as is possible at least three days before the meeting. No business shall be transacted at a special meeting except that mentioned in the call.

  6. 7 minutes ago, Alexis Hunt said:

    Definitely to the first two. For the third, it's not strictly necessary, but if the chair asks for unanimous consent by asking "Is there any objection?", it's important that members who do in fact have an objection speak up. This is true in any assembly, but it's especially true in such a small assembly where it would only take one more person to defeat the motion. Ultimately it depends a lot on group dynamics; the thing you really want to avoid is one or two persuasive members consistently getting their way because the procedure is lax. Does that make sense?

    Yeah I get it. Thanks!

  7. 3 minutes ago, Alexis Hunt said:

    Yes, that's absolutely fine. There's two caveats with this approach though:

    The first is that trying to always do business in an informal consent-based approach can lead to situations where people don't feel comfortable raising dissenting opinions. If one person feels like the other three agree, so they have to agree as well, it can be helpful to make it into a proper vote so that they have a chance to register their discontent. It's one thing if you use unanimous consent and people raise objections when appropriate; quite another when it ends up intimidating people into not raising their voices in opposition.

    The second is that it is almost more important to make sure that any decisions you're making be properly phrased and that everyone understands what's being agreed to. I've seen too many meetings where people talk about something at length, someone says "Does that sound good?", everyone agrees that it does, indeed, sound good, and then every packs up and leaves with a slightly different understanding of what actually was agreed to. Sometimes this isn't so bad, but sometimes it can be disastrous ("No, I thought you were booking the venue!").

    So essentially, the chair should encourage dissenting opinions, clarify the exact text of what we're agreeing to, and take formal votes to establish when a decision is truly being made?

  8. I'm on a committee of 4 people that has been tasked with planning the program for an event. Since the committee is so small and we almost always agree on things, is it okay to just run on unanimous consent until someone disagrees with something and raises an objection? The parliamentary authority is RONR and no bylaws provision contradicts my plan.

  9. 1 hour ago, Richard Brown said:

    It would help if you would quote the EXACT language from the parent's organization's constitution, bylaws or other rule which states specifically that upon being chartered, an affiliate organization is deemed to have adopted the standard bylaws provided by the parent organization.  Also quote the language about the parent organization being the only body that can amend an affiliate's constitution or bylaws.

    Edited to add:  I just read the "standard" constitution provided by Rotary International and also the "standard" bylaws.  The constitution does indeed say that it can be amended only by the parent body (I believe that is Rotary International).  The bylaws, on the other hand, can be amended by the local affiliate.   I'm still curious, though, as to what provision is in the parent organization's constitution and bylaws that states, in essence, that by applying ror and accepting a charter, the local affiliate is deemed to have adopted the standard constitution and also the standard bylaws.

    Found in section 8 of this official document of Rotary International (the parent organization) policy https://my.rotary.org/en/document/rotaract-statement-policy

    "There shall be a “Standard Rotaract Club Constitution” prescribed by Rotary International and subject to amendment only by the Board of Directors of Rotary International. As a prerequisite of its organization and certification, each Rotaract club shall adopt the "Standard Rotaract Club Constitution" and shall automatically adopt all amendments thereto subsequently made."

    By-laws are definitely amendable by local affiliate. My issue is that our constitution doesn't line up with the standard constitution (our constitution can be found here http://ufrotaract.wixsite.com/service/constitution).

  10. 4 hours ago, Alexis Hunt said:

    You should also dig into things such as whether or not your club was grandfathered when the standard club constitution was put into place, given an exemption, or whether the standard constitution is merely a helpful guideline and clubs are free to adopt another constitution.

    It's also possible that your club has the standard constitution but is simply unaware of that fact.

    Our custom constitution:

    http://ufrotaract.wixsite.com/service/constitution

    The standard constitution:

    https://my.rotary.org/en/document/rotaract-constitution-and-bylaws

    By-Laws vary by club, but the aforementioned PDF with the standard constitution includes starter by-laws. 

  11.  

    8 hours ago, Daniel H. Honemann said:

    I suspect that a great deal more facts are needed.

    Based solely upon what has been posted, it seems far more likely that your club may not be regarded as a chartered member of the larger organization to which you refer than that your club's constitution is null and void. If your club's constitution is null and void, it would appear that you have no club at all.

    Our custom constitution:

    http://ufrotaract.wixsite.com/service/constitution

    The standard constitution:

    https://my.rotary.org/en/document/rotaract-constitution-and-bylaws

    By-Laws vary by club, but the aforementioned PDF with the standard constitution includes starter by-laws. 

  12. 4 hours ago, Alexis Hunt said:

    You should also dig into things such as whether or not your club was grandfathered when the standard club constitution was put into place, given an exemption, or whether the standard constitution is merely a helpful guideline and clubs are free to adopt another constitution.

    It's also possible that your club has the standard constitution but is simply unaware of that fact.

    I've looked and no such grandfather clause exists for a club of our age. Every club must use the same standard constitution; it's a requirement, not a guideline.

     

    I think you're right. The standard constitution is the one truly in effect, but at some point in the past someone ignored the part of the standard constitution that says only the larger organization can amend it. This led to our current custom constitution.

  13. 7 hours ago, Daniel H. Honemann said:

    I suspect that a great deal more facts are needed.

    Based solely upon what has been posted, it seems far more likely that your club may not be regarded as a chartered member of the larger organization to which you refer than that your club's constitution is null and void. If your club's constitution is null and void, it would appear that you have no club at all.

    I've checked the larger organization's database and we're in there as a chartered member. The larger organization's policy is that every club adopts the standard constitution upon being chartered and that only the larger organization can amend the standard constitution. That's why I think the standard constitution is in effect, but we're just ignoring it.

  14. I belong to a club that is part of a larger organization. Whenever a club of this type is chartered, it adopts the organization's standard club constitution. However, my club has been using its own custom constitution. I believe that our custom constitution is null and void, and that the standard constitution is and always has been in effect. How would you suggest I go about transitioning to the standard constitution? I am just a member in the club.

     

    Our custom constitution:

    http://ufrotaract.wixsite.com/service/constitution

    The standard constitution:

    https://my.rotary.org/en/document/rotaract-constitution-and-bylaws

    By-Laws vary by club, but the aforementioned PDF with the standard constitution includes starter by-laws. 

  15. 25 minutes ago, George Mervosh said:

    If he doesn't show up at the next meeting, the assembly can elect a Secretary pro-tem to take minutes.  That will but a band aid on the problem for now.

    He is the secretary pro tem. We haven't passed bylaws yet. Could we elect another secretary pro tem?

  16. 7 minutes ago, Tom Coronite said:

    What if you don't have them then? It will be harder to recall what was done at the previous meeting as more time elapses. Perhaps it would be better for someone other than the mia secretary to offer a draft at the meeting in a few days. 

    Good point. I think I'll do that.

  17. Our second organizational meeting is just a few days away, but sadly our secretary has completely stopped replying to all of our attempts to contact him. As such, no one can retrieve the minutes of the first organizational meeting to approve at the second. Can we skip approving the minutes and just approve them at the meeting following the second organizational meeting?

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