George Mervosh

I got the impression these questions/comments/speeches, whatever, occured when the report is concluded. When the officer concludes his report and simply sits down, are questions asked after that really related to the "business at hand', or is it when the presiding officer moves on to the next report or other item of business that they become unrelated to the business at hand?

It would be consider proper under the rules in RONR to take occasional votes by email (whatever occasional votes means) if the bylaws authorize it, yes. You'll have to check with an attorney to see if there is some statutory rule regarding this matter.

Under the rules in RONR the answer is clearly, yes, as the bylaws take precedence over the rules in RONR. We can't answer any questions about what is legal or would stand up in court.

RONR on CD-Rom has some examples for election ballots, but I think if the assembly is dissatisfied with that format, they can direct that it not be used and I think a majority vote will suffice.

No new language is necessary. Just keep voting until the tie is broken. Make sure there is a place for write-ins. Also, consider re-opening nominations if repeated rounds of balloting aren't getting the job done.

Wait you have the 11th Edition? I know how you got the 10th, but which philanthropic member updated you to the 11th?

See your other thread.

Not enough facts, but maybe not. "Notice of filling a vacancy in an office (including a vacancy in an executive board or executive committee) must always be given to the members of the body that will elect the person to fill it, unless the bylaws or special rules of order clearly provide otherwise." RONR (11th ed.), p. 468 If the notice says you're not going to actually vote to fill the vacancy until July (for example), then it can't be voted on in the June meeting unless there are no members of the board who are absent at the June meeting. Also, the board may be required to follow certain other rules which would absolutely prohibit it......check with your board's attorney to see if there are any such applicable rules.

It can only be permitted if the bylaws authorize it. As to your question: " An organization should never adopt a bylaw permitting a question to be decided by a voting procedure in which the votes of persons who attend a meeting are counted together with ballots mailed in by absentees. The votes of those present could be affected by debate, by amendments, and perhaps by the need for repeated balloting, while those absent would be unable to adjust their votes to reflect these factors. Consequently, the absentee ballots would in most cases be on a somewhat different question than that on which those present were voting, leading to confusion, unfairness, and inaccuracy in determining the result." RONR (11th ed), p. 423.

1) Correct. The Secretary's draft is just that, an unapproved draft. 2) Not exactly. It's the Secretary's draft that is presented for approval. If the Secretary chooses to entertain changes to the draft he can, but he's not obliged to, nor is the Secretary obliged to let anyone have a copy of the draft prior to presenting it for approval at the meeting. 3) Correct. The Secretary can make multiple changes to the draft without telling anyone what they are. 4) Please see Mr. Martin's post again.......there's too much in the portion of the draft you posted. 5) See Mr. Honemann's post again. 6) Oh heck read every response again.

No rule in RONR prevents a member from holding more than one position.

RONR does define what rights non-voting members have, and, in fact, does not use the term non-voting member.

" In case of the resignation or death of the president, the vice-president (if there is only one) or the first vice-president (if there are more than one) automatically becomes president for the unexpired term, unless the bylaws expressly provide otherwise for filling a vacancy in the office of president. " RONR (11th ed.), p.458. Based on the rules in RONR, you are now President. A vacancy exists in the office of Vice President. If you don't want to continue as president you'll need to resign. If you resign, an election (with previous notice) will need to be held to fill the vacancy in the office of president and vice president.

Fair enough.

Guest Harper can read this thread if he's interested in more on this subject, but yeah, simply agreeing with Mr. Martin is far less time consuming. http://robertsrules.forumflash.com/index.php?/topic/20385-executive-session/&

Let me say that I accept your interpretation of the rules in RONR (which is what this thread is about, really), as I accept SG’s and any other member of the authorship team’s interpretation on this matter and any time an interpretation of RONR is required. My acceptance also lies in the fact I can’t come up with an argument against it that would satisfy myself, much less anyone else. I was very content to agree with my colleagues on the Q&A team at the time the answer was written, as I believed the answer was a proper application of the rules in RONR, so I can easily understand why others would agree with our answer. This thread was very illuminating and I appreciate everyone’s opinion.

Yes, sir, that's what this whole fuss is all about.

Well I certainly believe those two elements are absolutely essential and cannot be superseded by a special rule of order, and as far as I understood it, the Q&A doesn't state anything which contradicts that. I also don't think the Q&A in any way states having a proper tellers report isn't essential. It's the last part of your post that the Q&A is addressing.

Yes, he may vote. The appointment of committee chairs affects everyone so he need not abstain.

The superior body's governing documents need to be studied to determine if they require subordinate units to comply in this or other areas. "If the unit for which the bylaws are to be drawn up is subject to a parent organization or superior body, such as a state or a national society (or both), or a federation, the bylaws governing at these higher levels should be studied for provisions which are binding upon subordinate units in a way that must be taken into account. The bylaws of a subordinate unit need to conform to those of a superior body only on clearly requisite points. For example, if the superior body limits the size of its subordinate units to 200 members, the bylaws should contain this limit or one that is lower. But the subordinate unit should not adopt provisions from the other document that have no local application, and the bylaws of the superior body should not require it to do so" RONR (11th ed.), pp. 567-568

Once again, please read the cited pages. Of course

It's not a motion to adjourn. It's establishing an adjourned meeting which in essence is a continuation of the November meeting. I suggest you read the cited pages. If your group wants to adopt bylaw language to help with whatever the problem is, that's fine, but until they do, an adjourned meeting is an option.

No, but while the election is pending in November, your group can establish and adjourned meeting to take place before the next regular meeting in December and then postpone the election to that adjourned meeting. See RONR (11th ed.), p. 242ff

This member of the Q&A research team has no doubt that reporting the count is an essential element of a ballot vote. But what I did believe is, that particular element of a ballot vote could be superseded by a special rule of order rather than a bylaw level rule, and I did not believe that an assembly violating the rule regarding the report of the count would be non-compliant with a rule in the bylaws requiring a vote by ballot for an election. Now we all have more to think about. I find this discussion extremely enlightening.