Proper Etiquette

[felithom]

Is there proper protocol listed in RONR for relieving an administrator of her duties if she doesn't perform as she should? This is a lady who has worked for our association for several years. Periodically, throughout the year, she simply "checks out" and is unavailable for weeks at a time. Her duties are mostly via email/internet...no physical locale. Please help!

[J. J.]

Is the administrator an officer? Is she under contract, and if so, when does it expire?

[Guest Edgar]

Is there proper protocol listed in RONR for relieving an administrator of her duties if she doesn't perform as she should?

See FAQ #20.

[J. J.]

See FAQ #20.

If the administrator is not an officer, that might not be applicable.

[Guest Edgar]

If the administrator is not an officer, that might not be applicable.

Much like chicken soup, it can't hurt (to look).

[felithom]

She is not an officer. She is paid a handsome sum for a part-time job -- to which, she's often unavailable to carry through with requests made by the officers.

[felithom]

No contract.

[Weldon Merritt]

Much like chicken soup, it can't hurt (to look).

It might, if it leads the organization to erromeously believe that those provisions apply when they do not. If the adminstrtor is an employee, there may be (and most likely are) much different considerations that apply.

[Guest Edgar]

It might, if it leads the organization to erromeously believe that those provisions apply when they do not.

Why would it lead the organization to believe those provisions apply when they do not? FAQ #20 clearly refers to the removal of officers. We didn't know if the "administrator" was an officer but now we know that she is not. So it seems clear that FAQ #20 does not apply. No harm, no foul.

On other hand, if it had turned out that the "administrator" was, indeed, an officer, FAQ #20 might have been helpful. It's just information, it's not dangerous.

[felithom]

Our administrator has a regular full-time job outside of our non-profit organization. She is paid a handsome sum to be at the disposal of officers to do administrative tasks. She is not on contract. She is not an officer. I simply cannot find anything in RONR to address this issue. Perhaps there is no protocol listed.

[Trina]

Our administrator has a regular full-time job outside of our non-profit organization. She is paid a handsome sum to be at the disposal of officers to do administrative tasks. She is not on contract. She is not an officer. I simply cannot find anything in RONR to address this issue. Perhaps there is no protocol listed.

Well, it sounds as though you want to fire an employee. From the p.o.v. of parliamentary procedure, if a motion was made some time in the past to hire her, that motion can be rescinded (the motion to rescind requires two-thirds vote without notice OR majority vote with notice OR majority vote of the entire membership). Your topic title mentions "etiquette"... I'm not sure how proper etiquette really comes into it. There might be legal issues involved with firing an employee, although that seems less likely if there is no contract involved. If there are legal issues, RONR is not the place to find answers.

[Josh Martin]

Your topic title mentions "etiquette"... I'm not sure how proper etiquette really comes into it.

Well, it might be wise to have someone sit down with the employee to explain the situation and ask her to resign. She may be willing to do so in order to avoid the embarrassment of being fired.

[Trina]

Well, it might be wise to have someone sit down with the employee to explain the situation and ask her to resign. She may be willing to do so in order to avoid the embarrassment of being fired.

I certainly agree. However, the original poster commented that: "I simply cannot find anything in RONR to address this issue." RONR does not appear to contain the rules of etiquette the poster was searching for .

[Josh Martin]

I certainly agree. However, the original poster commented that: "I simply cannot find anything in RONR to address this issue." RONR does not appear to contain the rules of etiquette the poster was searching for .

RONR certainly has very little to say about employees, but what is said in RONR, 11th ed., pg. 656, lines 7-12 seems to be wise advice for employees as well (not just for members and officers). Additionally, there are general rules of etiquette in RONR, 11th ed., pgs. 391-394, which may become applicable if the issue does (unfortunately) come before the board for formal action. I'm not sure whether either of those citations cover what the poster was looking for.

[Steven Britton]

Generally, the only parliamentary etiquette or protocol that is remotely applicable in your situation is the closing of the meeting's session (executive session) to deliberate your organization's employee issue. However, Robert's is silent regarding an employee's rights to due process. We can tell you how to make the motion to move into an executive session, but (in this specific case) not whether you should. I would caution that you contact a qualified legal professional before taking any sort of action against an employee.

[Chris Harrison]

Well, it sounds as though you want to fire an employee. From the p.o.v. of parliamentary procedure, if a motion was made some time in the past to hire her, that motion can be rescinded ...

Wouldn't the motion to hire the employee be fully executed upon her being officially hired and thus cannot be Rescinded now? It would seem to me that if they want to fire her that they could do so with the normal majority vote (unless the bylaws require a higher threshold).

[Rev Ed]

My suggestion is this: check with a lawyer who specializes in employment law. Find out what the Board's options are. It might be easier to pass a motion to terminate her employment "without cause." In other words, you may have to pay off the employee (or provide a notice period) but might be esier than trying to prove that the employee has done a bad job and should not be paid off to leave.

The issue really relates to employment, not RONR. Thus we really cannot be of much help.

[Trina]

Wouldn't the motion to hire the employee be fully executed upon her being officially hired and thus cannot be Rescinded now? It would seem to me that if they want to fire her that they could do so with the normal majority vote (unless the bylaws require a higher threshold).

I agree. I was sloppy in firing off my earlier response.

It would depend on the wording of whatever motion enabled the hiring in the first place. Most likely, that motion has already been fully executed.

[Josh Martin]

My suggestion is this: check with a lawyer who specializes in employment law. Find out what the Board's options are. It might be easier to pass a motion to terminate her employment "without cause." In other words, you may have to pay off the employee (or provide a notice period) but might be esier than trying to prove that the employee has done a bad job and should not be paid off to leave.

The issue really relates to employment, not RONR. Thus we really cannot be of much help.

I'm in full agreement that the society should determine if there are legal considerations in play, but I don't think we should speculate on what might be involved in that, as you do in your third and fourth sentences.

[J. J.]

Wouldn't the motion to hire the employee be fully executed upon her being officially hired and thus cannot be Rescinded now? It would seem to me that if they want to fire her that they could do so with the normal majority vote (unless the bylaws require a higher threshold).

You must have been reading my mind. If the motion was "That ____ be hired as administrator," a another motion to terminate her employment , "That ____ 's employment as administrator be ended," would be in order.

I do think it is sage advice to suggest contacting an attorney that is familiar with labor law.

[HAWVET]

Wouldn't the motion to hire the employee be fully executed upon her being officially hired and thus cannot be Rescinded now? It would seem to me that if they want to fire her that they could do so with the normal majority vote (unless the bylaws require a higher threshold).

I thought this would be appropriate if the matter to hire a particular individual was executed in one of their meetings.

We have a similar situation with one paid employee. Answers should be in the organizations by-laws and other documents which led to the hiring of the administrator. If a paid administrator was established in the by-laws, it should include rules on how it is to be administered. The non-profit organization must be in full compliance with labor laws and compliance with rules on income/social security tax deductions.

The op asked on protocol for relieving an administrator if she doesn’t perform. What duties was the administrator allegedly, not in compliance? Where is it described? What was the hiring process? What was the salary? Who is the supervisor? This is an employer/employee relationship and most likely not covered under RONR, except possibly after a decision to terminate is made and must be brought up before the membership.