Sean Hunt Posted October 22, 2012 at 08:32 PM Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 at 08:32 PM Should a counted vote on a secondary motion be included in the minutes, if there is no other reason to include the secondary motion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted October 22, 2012 at 08:50 PM Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 at 08:50 PM No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shmuel Gerber Posted October 23, 2012 at 03:45 AM Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 at 03:45 AM No.George, you're probably getting a bit more than the standard online rate of $4.50/hr, so would you care to throw in a citation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Novosielski Posted October 23, 2012 at 04:20 AM Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 at 04:20 AM George, you're probably getting a bit more than the standard online rate of $4.50/hr, so would you care to throw in a citation? Are you disagreeing with George? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Honemann Posted October 23, 2012 at 12:14 PM Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 at 12:14 PM George, you're probably getting a bit more than the standard online rate of $4.50/hr, so would you care to throw in a citation? 2FP hit men don't bother with citations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted October 23, 2012 at 02:30 PM Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 at 02:30 PM George, you're probably getting a bit more than the standard online rate of $4.50/hr, so would you care to throw in a citation? Are you disagreeing with George?Neh, but if he is, he'll be by (within a quarterly time interval) to tell me why. Nothing in RONR suggests that a secondary motion that was lost (and thereby not recorded at all – p. 470, l. 1) is somehow transformed into one that should be recorded in the minutes solely by virtue of the fact that the vote was counted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shmuel Gerber Posted October 23, 2012 at 03:34 PM Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 at 03:34 PM Are you disagreeing with George?Neh, but if he is, he'll be by (within a quarterly time interval) to tell me why. Nothing in RONR suggests that a secondary motion that was lost (and thereby not recorded at all – p. 470, l. 1) is somehow transformed into one that should be recorded in the minutes solely by virtue of the fact that the vote was counted.I'm not disagreeing, but I had hoped that whatever reasoning or citation you had would both explain your answer and also show whether a count of the vote on a secondary motion that is alluded to in the minutes should be included. For example, would the minutes say, "a ballot vote having been ordered, the tellers ..." or, rather, "a ballot vote having been ordered by a vote of 35 in the affirmative and 25 in the negative, the tellers ..."? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnR Posted October 23, 2012 at 04:21 PM Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 at 04:21 PM Perhaps the difference lies in the fact that secondary motions are temporary devices. Future interest in or controversy over the vote would be in relation to the main motion, which has (or could have had) continued life and effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted October 23, 2012 at 04:41 PM Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 at 04:41 PM I'm not disagreeing, but I had hoped that whatever reasoning or citation you had would both explain your answer and also show whether a count of the vote on a secondary motion that is alluded to in the minutes should be included. For example, would the minutes say, "a ballot vote having been ordered, the tellers ..." or, rather, "a ballot vote having been ordered by a vote of 35 in the affirmative and 25 in the negative, the tellers ..."?No, that’s fair.I don’t think I need to add more than the above regarding Sean’s direct question since RONR is clear on p. 470 line 1 that the motion isn’t recorded at all, and yes, I do think that a secondary motion where a ballot vote has been ordered would be included and it might read something like: “A ballot vote having been ordered on the motion to: “Suspend the Rules and……", the tellers report that there were 35 votes in the affirmative and 15 votes in the negative, and the motion was adopted.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Honemann Posted October 23, 2012 at 06:11 PM Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 at 06:11 PM 2FP hit men answer only the question asked (in this case: "Should a counted vote on a secondary motion be included in the minutes, if there is no other reason to include the secondary motion?"), and don't bother with citations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted October 23, 2012 at 06:23 PM Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 at 06:23 PM 2FP hit men answer only the question asked (in this case: "Should a counted vote on a secondary motion be included in the minutes, if there is no other reason to include the secondary motion?"), and don't bother with citations.Why must you get him started, at my expense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. J. Posted November 10, 2012 at 01:02 AM Report Share Posted November 10, 2012 at 01:02 AM Should a counted vote on a secondary motion be included in the minutes, if there is no other reason to include the secondary motion?The counting might eliminate the "no other reason to include" criteria. I think it would fall under p. 470, #7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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