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Failure to pass motion to adjourn in absence of a quorum


Guest David Adamovich

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I'm finding myself in a parliamentary pickle, i.e., my organization has a quorum of 20. If 15 show up and I call the meeting to order I understand it's appropriate and not improper to entertain a motion to adjourn (hoping we get a quorum at the next monthly meeting, of course). The results: 7 in the affirmative, 8 in the negative. How do I close the meeting? I have to presume they're not going to vote for a time to adjourn or whatever else is permissible. In essence I'm faced with the inability to close the meeting. Is there a way out of this mess?

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The results: 7 in the affirmative, 8 in the negative. How do I close the meeting?

 

You don't. The assembly doesn't have to adjourn if it doesn't want to. My best guess is that they're hoping five more members will show up eventually and want to try waiting a bit longer.

 

In essence I'm faced with the inability to close the meeting. Is there a way out of this mess?

 

I would inform the members of the other very limited options available to them at an inquorate meeting - to recess, to fix the time to which to adjourn (setting up an adjourned meeting), or to take measures to obtain a quorum. In most assemblies, that last one generally means something like calling members and asking them to pretty please come to the meeting.

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What I'm getting from your informed answer is that the meeting is not closed in the absence of an affirmed motion to adjourn. But you're telling me they don't have to adjourn if they don't want to. But knowing I've passed the time to "pray" more people show up I'm left with being short of the quorum, an open meeting, and no one willing to officially shut business down. You say I can recess, to fix the time to which to adjourn, or to take measures to obtain a quorum. The last just ain't gonna happen. So I'm stuck with trying to close an inquorate meeting with motions other than a failed motion to adjourn: recess or fix a time to which to adjourn. Once again, they appear to require a majority vote in the affirmative. You've not given me a way to walk out of that room if all options fail to pass. That loops me back to the parliamentary pickle I find myself in, i.e. lacking the majority vote to recess or adjourn. This appears to be an unsolvable riddle and loophole in RRoO. 

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You've not given me a way to walk out of that room if all options fail to pass.

 

Just walk out of the room. Those members of the assembly who wish to remain can elect a Chairman Pro Tempore to preside over the remainder of their pointless meeting.

 

I said you can't close the meeting. I never said you had to stay. :)

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Thank you, I guess my suspicion was right. It appears there isn't a parliamentary solution other than to walk out the door. If I'm incorrect in saying that I'm willing to listen but will all the things that are covered in an extensive set of rules it's odd something as simple as that was overlooked.

 

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 . . . it's odd something as simple as that was overlooked.

 

What's odd is that simply leaving the room was overlooked by you.

 

I can understand that, as the presiding officer, you might feel an obligation to remain until the meeting is properly adjourned but, at some point (around sunrise?) I would hope you'd inform the other members that you have other obligations which require that you leave.

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What's odd is that simply leaving the room was overlooked by you.

 

I can understand that, as the presiding officer, you might feel an obligation to remain until the meeting is properly adjourned but, at some point (around sunrise?) I would hope you'd inform the other members that you have other obligations which require that you leave.

 

Tsk, GE, the man misinterpreted his duties and doesn't grasp all of the fundamentals of RONR...one of which, if memory serves, is the assumption that a meeting's purpose is to conduct business among reasoning people of good will, or some such other kumbayah-ish sentiment. So maybe cut him a little slack?

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Those members of the assembly who wish to remain can elect a Chairman Pro Tempore to preside over the remainder of their pointless meeting.

 

Though if I remember correctly I read here once that a Chair pro tem can't be elected in an inquorate meeting.  I suppose assuming there is no Vice President or Vice Chair at the meeting the assembly would be stuck with the Secretary pulling double duty until a quorum showed up or everyone went home.

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 . . .  the assembly would be stuck with the Secretary pulling double duty until a quorum showed up or everyone went home.

 

I'm not sure there's anything in RONR to suggest that the secretary becomes the presiding officer in the absence of the president and vice-president but if that's the case, and in this instance, if I were the secretary I'd probably go home too. Long before "everyone" went home. Nothing in RONR obligates the president or the vice-president or the secretary to be the last man standing.

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Though if I remember correctly I read here once that a Chair pro tem can't be elected in an inquorate meeting.  I suppose assuming there is no Vice President or Vice Chair at the meeting the assembly would be stuck with the Secretary pulling double duty until a quorum showed up or everyone went home.

 

I think you read incorrectly, as this would relate to "the conduct of the meeting while it remains without a quorum (p. 348, ll. 1-2)."

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Thank you, I guess my suspicion was right. It appears there isn't a parliamentary solution other than to walk out the door. If I'm incorrect in saying that I'm willing to listen but will all the things that are covered in an extensive set of rules it's odd something as simple as that was overlooked.

 

 

If the inquate assembly wishes to remain in session perpetually (or less), it may do so.  If you don't stay in the meeting perpetually (or just after this point) you may leave.  :)

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Thank you, I guess my suspicion was right. It appears there isn't a parliamentary solution other than to walk out the door. If I'm incorrect in saying that I'm willing to listen but will all the things that are covered in an extensive set of rules it's odd something as simple as that was overlooked.

 

Nothing is overlooked. The assembly cannot be forced to adjourn against its will. Why it is the assembly's will not to adjourn in the situation you describe is beyond me, but if they want to sit around and do nothing, that is their right.

 

I assume that the members will resolve the situation eventually by adjourning the meeting, or by all of them leaving (which effectively adjourns the meeting).

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Aha, poking through RRoO I find the following on page 240, "Cases where the Assembly can adjourn without a motion." Essentially, if the hour for adjournment is reached the chair simply announces the fact and declares the meeting adjourned. Likewise, if we add that and the following to our By Laws, "If after 3 attempts at calling a meeting to order in the absence of a quorum the presiding officer may call the meeting adjourned." Do I cover all bases here, in essence walking away without the majority vote to adjourn in an inquorate situation and the right to "kill" the meeting if it's going way too long and interfering with the commencing of an after-meeting lecturer?

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Aha, poking through RRoO I find the following on page 240, "Cases where the Assembly can adjourn without a motion." Essentially, if the hour for adjournment is reached the chair simply announces the fact and declares the meeting adjourned.

 

Yes, but (at least from the facts as I understand them), the assembly has not set the hour for adjournment.

 

If I've missed something, and the assembly has set the hour for adjournment, then yes, you can declare the meeting adjourned when that time is reached.

 

Aha, poking through RRoO I find the following on page 240, "Cases where the Assembly can adjourn without a motion." Essentially, if the hour for adjournment is reached the chair simply announces the fact and declares the meeting adjourned. Likewise, if we add that and the following to our By Laws, "If after 3 attempts at calling a meeting to order in the absence of a quorum the presiding officer may call the meeting adjourned." Do I cover all bases here, in essence walking away without the majority vote to adjourn in an inquorate situation and the right to "kill" the meeting if it's going way too long and interfering with the commencing of an after-meeting lecturer?

 

Well, you don't attempt to call the meeting to order when there's not a quorum, you do call the meeting to order. So you may need to tweak that wording a bit, although I think I understand what you're trying to get at.

 

As for the after-meeting lecturer, though, why not have the lecturer during the meeting if there's not a quorum? It's not like you're going to be doing anything else.

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Aha, poking through RRoO I find the following on page 240, "Cases where the Assembly can adjourn without a motion." Essentially, if the hour for adjournment is reached the chair simply announces the fact and declares the meeting adjourned. Likewise, if we add that and the following to our By Laws, "If after 3 attempts at calling a meeting to order in the absence of a quorum the presiding officer may call the meeting adjourned." Do I cover all bases here, in essence walking away without the majority vote to adjourn in an inquorate situation and the right to "kill" the meeting if it's going way too long and interfering with the commencing of an after-meeting lecturer?

 

Yeah, that's not gonna work.  Your first attempt to call the meeting to order will invariably succeed.  After that, there is no opportunity for a second attempt, much less a third.

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