Guest Amanda Posted July 6, 2014 at 05:10 AM Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 at 05:10 AM Our Association allows for clubs to be members. The clubs are represented by Club Delegates chosen by the individual clubs. The clubs receive a vote through the delegate. In theory the delegate is supposed to obtain their individual club's voting desires and vote for their club. Delegates for clubs can change. Does the club delegate automatically become a member of the Association? Should the acting delegates be required to purchase their own membership? Our by laws do not cover this. They simply say we can have club memberships, individual memberships, and honorary memberships. Because the club delegate can change, it would seem to reason that the delegates themselves must be members in order to represent their member club. Can a delegate for a club be nominated for an office when they are not a single member? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstackpo Posted July 6, 2014 at 05:31 AM Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 at 05:31 AM Unfortunately (for you, not for us - we have enough on our plates just keeping up with RONR) these questions are all matters of bylaw interpretation or indeed should be explicitly answered in your Association bylaws. Bylaw interpretation is up to the Association. Page 588. But here's some things to think about: When an association has a (standard) meeting, all the "members" of the association are entitled to attend, debate, vote, &c. When an association holds a convention of delegates (often from constituent bodies - "Clubs" in your case) only those registered delegates are entitled to attend, &c. even though the association has members. But it looks as though your association has mixed the two kinds of gatherings into one pot. It will be up to you to sort that one out: are your "gatherings" member meetings, or conventions of delegates, or a hybrid? A hybrid like this is not described in RONR, so you will have to figure out what your hybrid is. When you sort this out, most of your questions will be answered. Need help? Anticipate yourContinuing big troublesAre procedural?Should get in touch withReal parliamentarianIn your areaAs soon as you can(Not virtual ones like us)For consultations.(Can you do Haiku better, please?)Contact either (or both) the ...National Association of Parliamentarians213 South Main St.Independence, MO 64050-3850Phone: 888-627-2929Fax: 816-833-3893; e-mail: hq@NAP2.org <<www.parliamentarians.org>>orAmerican Institute of Parliamentarians550M Ritchie Highway #271Severna Park, MD 21146Phone: 888-664-0428Fax: 410-544-4640e-mail: aip@aipparl.org<<www.aipparl.org>>for a reference or information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Posted July 6, 2014 at 12:14 PM Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 at 12:14 PM Nothing in RONR would require a delegate to be a member of the association (or a member of the club, for that matter). It seems a little unusual that your association is mixing individual memberships and club memberships. In the RONR understanding of membership, a person who is a member of the association is entitled to vote, as is a club that is a member. So, what if a person who is a member is also a delegate? Does the person get to vote twice? That is up to your association bylaws to say, but it can become a nightmare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Amanda Posted July 6, 2014 at 01:38 PM Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 at 01:38 PM Thanks for your responses. It does appear as if we have a bit of an issue and that we do have a mixed mess. We have meetings that only the club delegates attend as they comprise the Board of Directors. The annual meeting is open to everyone. We do have some delegates who are also individual members and those people do have a vote in addition to a vote as a club representative. It appears as if this aspect needs to be clarified in our by laws??????? The problem we are faced with currently is that club delegates can change at any time and are in theory only a club representative and thus would not be eligible to run for an office because the club is the member, not the individual representing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstackpo Posted July 6, 2014 at 01:52 PM Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 at 01:52 PM We do have some delegates who are also individual members and those people do have a vote in addition to a vote as a club representative. It appears as if this aspect needs to be clarified in our by laws???????You bet it does, particularly since this clearly violates the "one man [oh, alright, 'person'], one vote" principle - p. 407. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nancy N. Posted July 6, 2014 at 09:34 PM Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 at 09:34 PM ... It does appear as if we have a bit of an issue and that we do have a mixed mess.... It appears as if this aspect needs to be clarified in our by laws??????? This aspect needs to be clarified in your by laws!!!!!!! ... The problem we are faced with currently is that club delegates ... mwould not be eligible to run for an office because the club is the member, not the individual representing it. Amanda, currently, how does it work with clubs serving as officers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Novosielski Posted July 6, 2014 at 11:38 PM Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 at 11:38 PM The problem we are faced with currently is that club delegates can change at any time and are in theory only a club representative and thus would not be eligible to run for an office because the club is the member, not the individual representing it. And also because the club, although a member, is not a human being, and is therefore not eligible to be elected to anything. In general, however, it should be noted that, unless the bylaws demand it, being a member is not a requirement for holding office. Being a human being is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Posted July 7, 2014 at 03:16 AM Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 at 03:16 AM And also because the club, although a member, is not a human being, and is therefore not eligible to be elected to anything. In general, however, it should be noted that, unless the bylaws demand it, being a member is not a requirement for holding office. Being a human being is. On which page do you find it written that being human is a requirement for election? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Guest Posted July 7, 2014 at 11:10 AM Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 at 11:10 AM On which page do you find it written that being human is a requirement for election? Indeed. We frequently get questions here concerning procedures in small dog clubs (which, presumably, consist of small dogs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstackpo Posted July 7, 2014 at 11:36 AM Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 at 11:36 AM Small dogs as members, but human people as delegates from the "Club(s) of Owners". Still have to figure out how the voting works at conventions (AKA "dog shows"), however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shmuel Gerber Posted July 7, 2014 at 09:49 PM Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 at 09:49 PM On which page do you find it written that being human is a requirement for election? If I asked Lt.-Cmdr. Data to look this up for me, he would probably just ask, "What is a page?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Posted July 7, 2014 at 10:01 PM Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 at 10:01 PM If I asked Lt.-Cmdr. Data to look this up for me, he would probably just ask, "What is a page?" Sadly, Mr. Data is dead, but I was thinking more in terms of a real world situation. While it wouldn't make sense for a club to be nominated and elected as president, a club might be elected to host the next meeting or something else that a club could do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Guest Posted July 7, 2014 at 10:05 PM Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 at 10:05 PM Sadly, Mr. Data is dead . . . Was he ever alive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Harrison Posted July 7, 2014 at 11:00 PM Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 at 11:00 PM Was he ever alive?Yes. After a hearing Starfleet deemed him to be a sentient being and affirmed his right to refuse to be disassembled just so the SF Corp of Engineers could figure out what made him tick (so to speak). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nancy N. Posted July 8, 2014 at 01:13 AM Report Share Posted July 8, 2014 at 01:13 AM Was he ever alive?Shouldn't that be "will be alive"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Harrison Posted July 8, 2014 at 01:23 AM Report Share Posted July 8, 2014 at 01:23 AM Shouldn't that be "will be alive"?He was alive and will be alive again (remember he left his head in San Fran back in the late 1800s). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nancy N. Posted July 8, 2014 at 01:40 AM Report Share Posted July 8, 2014 at 01:40 AM He was alive and will be alive again (remember he left his head in San Fran back in the late 1800s). But aside from his time-travelling head, he's from the 23rd Century or so. Amanda, you getting all this sophisticated parliamentary information? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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