Bringing an issue to a revote

[Guest Becky]

I recently was involved in a vote for an organization, where one-third of the members of a 23 member board were present which falls within the quorum requirements according to our bylaws.  A vote was taken on an issue by paper ballot.  I do not recall that a motion was made or seconded prior to the vote.  The ballot had language that would have resembled the motion had it been stated and had a “Yes” or “No” box.   The vote passed 7 to 1.  I was the “the 1” vote.  I, as well as other members that were not present, feel the issue should be discussed and revoted on at a new meeting.  I submitted the required board signatures per our bylaws to request a special meeting be held to “discuss and re-vote” on this issue previously voted on.  The president and I had some procedural debate, with the following quote being her most reason for denial of my request:  “The vote that was held at the last meeting was to appeal a decision made by the committee. The parties were notified of the decision. Unless the vote was procedurally incorrect and the incorrect piece affects the outcome of the vote, the decision stands unless new information comes before the group and the prevailing side wishes to reconsider the vote. Otherwise we could have different people ask for a new vote endlessly on a decision that was made that they disagree with.”  Question 1:  Was the original vote legal since there was not a motion made or seconded before the actual vote took place beyond the language on the ballot?  Question 2:  Does the president’s position to deny my request adhere to procedural rules?

[Timothy]

It does sound like things were done improperly, and a point of order should have be raised at the time. I do not see anything here that would make this a continuing breach, so the motion (such as it was) and vote should stand.

 

The president is partially correct; you cannot reconsider the vote. You can, however, rescind or amend something previously adopted.

[Edgar Guest]

You can, however, rescind or amend something previously adopted.

 

Unless the action authorized by the previously adopted motion has been completely carried out (as in our favorite "paint the clubhouse" example).

 

In this case it seems that the motion that was adopted was to appeal a committee decision. So it would seem that the adoption of the motion, in itself, constitutes completion of the authorized action. Unless there's some additional step in the appeal process that hasn't yet been carried out.

[Kim Goldsworthy]

I recently was involved in a vote for an organization, where one-third of the members of a 23 member board were present which falls within the quorum requirements according to our bylaws. 

A vote was taken on an issue by paper ballot. 

I do not recall that a motion was made or seconded prior to the vote. 

[...]

I, as well as other members that were not present, feel the issue should be discussed and revoted on at a new meeting. 

I submitted the required board signatures per our bylaws to request a special meeting be held to “discuss and re-vote” on this issue previously voted on.  The president and I had some procedural debate, with the following quote being her most reason for denial of my request: 

“The vote that was held at the last meeting was to appeal a decision made by the committee.

The parties were notified of the decision.

Unless the vote was procedurally incorrect and the incorrect piece affects the outcome of the vote, the decision stands unless new information comes before the group and the prevailing side wishes to reconsider the vote.

Otherwise we could have different people ask for a new vote endlessly on a decision that was made that they disagree with.” 

 

Question 1:  Was the original vote legal since there was not a motion made or seconded before the actual vote took place beyond the language on the ballot? 

 

Question 2:  Does the president’s position to deny my request adhere to procedural rules?

A1. Probably, yes.

The fact that the motion "evolved" out of a loose discussion will not invalidate a vote taken on the resulting motion.

The assembly had ample opportunity to amend that loosely worded main motion into a tighter construction.

For that matter, the assembly should have voted down any main motion (a.) they did not understand; or (b.) they could not obey or fulfill.

So, the voters have spoken. - Vox populi.

 

A2. Unknown.

Too many non-Robertian rules and to much ambiguous information all interfere with the plain application of Robert's Rules.

 

Example:

• You said "board" ("... 23 member ...). President said "committee" ("... decison made by ...").

• You required signatures. RONR requires no signatures.

• President said, "... appeal a decision..." RONR, if applicable, would have required Amend Something Previous Adopted, i.e., no appeal necessary and no signatures necessary. No "Reconsideration" necessary, either.

 

So, there could be half a dozen reasons why:

(a.) your president was correct

(b.) your president was incorrect.

And there could be a mix-and-match situation. -- You are partially correct and your president is partially correct.

 

That is why "unknown" is my reply.

[Guest Guest]

So, per the comments I have received so far, is there any reason that I can not bring forth a request to reconvene to discuss the issue and vote to amend or rescind the original decision?  My understanding of the rules, is that anyone can bring a motion to rescind or amend an original motion regardless of how I voted the first time.  The president is stating that this can not be done, because there were no procedural errors made during the original vote.

[jstackpo]

You are correct  --  the pres is in error.

 

Rescind/Amend is entirely proper  --  as long as whatever the adopted motion proposed has not been completely carried out.  (You can't rescind the paint off the wall.)  p. 305

[Guest Hiram hernandez]

I am the president of a business association and a motion was presented to the board on an issue that was not on the agenda (without any discussion) I did not accept the motion.  the motion was second without me asking to be-second, I refused to present the question to the board and one other board member presented the question and voted upon it and pass with only one vote against, my vote.  is this a valid motion.  

[Richard Brown]

Guest Hiram, would you post your question as a new topic?  The board works best that way.

[Gary Novosielski]

I am the president of a business association and a motion was presented to the board on an issue that was not on the agenda (without any discussion) I did not accept the motion.  the motion was second without me asking to be-second, I refused to present the question to the board and one other board member presented the question and voted upon it and pass with only one vote against, my vote.  is this a valid motion.  

Yes.