Guest TonyK Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:24 PM Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:24 PM Our non-profit corporation recently used a paper ballot for the election of the board position of president. The election process itself followed the rules spelled out in the bylaws. The ballots were counted by the current president (who was NOT running for the position) and the current secretary, and they announced the winner of the election. I have no reason to believe there was any foul play with the election. A few days later, just out of curiosity I asked the president what the vote count was (in a social setting), and he told me that since no one asked at the meeting, he preferred not to make that known. This was very surprising to me, and now has me wondering what is going on. I have not asked for this vote count at a regular meeting (we haven't had one yet since the election). There is nothing in the bylaws about reporting the actual vote counts from the election. We have always been a very "open" organization. Now it doesn't feel that way, which I find very troubling. My question - Is there a way to force this vote count to be reported at a meeting? Can I make a motion at the next meeting to have the vote count reported, and if a majority approves do they have to report it? I am not contesting the election results, I just want to know what the vote count was. Can anyone provide guidance on this? Or should I just drop it and move on? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:41 PM Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:41 PM Our non-profit corporation recently used a paper ballot for the election of the board position of president. The election process itself followed the rules spelled out in the bylaws. The ballots were counted by the current president (who was NOT running for the position) and the current secretary, and they announced the winner of the election. I have no reason to believe there was any foul play with the election. A few days later, just out of curiosity I asked the president what the vote count was (in a social setting), and he told me that since no one asked at the meeting, he preferred not to make that known. This was very surprising to me, and now has me wondering what is going on. I have not asked for this vote count at a regular meeting (we haven't had one yet since the election). There is nothing in the bylaws about reporting the actual vote counts from the election. We have always been a very "open" organization. Now it doesn't feel that way, which I find very troubling. My question - Is there a way to force this vote count to be reported at a meeting? Can I make a motion at the next meeting to have the vote count reported, and if a majority approves do they have to report it? I am not contesting the election results, I just want to know what the vote count was. Can anyone provide guidance on this? Or should I just drop it and move on? Thanks Reporting the vote count prior to declaring the results is required by RONR and the vote count is also reported in the minutes, by rule. Next time, raise a point of order immediately, since the rules are being violated. It's too late now to raise a point of order but I would make a Request for Information at the next meeting and ask, if you are still curious, yes. You might want to let the President know you won't be putting up with that failure to follow the rules in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Novosielski Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:42 PM Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:42 PM A complete account of the vote totals, rejected ballots, total votes, etc, must be announced at the election meeting. This is normally done via a teller's report, but apparently the president appointed himself and the secretary as tellers. It must also be recorded in the minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstackpo Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:49 PM Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:49 PM A variation on what George M suggested: When the minutes come up for approval next meeting, insist that the vote count be included, via an amendment to the draft minutes, since that is what the rules (RONR) call for. I don't think this is "too late" as a point of order about a rule violation because you have no knowledge that the minutes were lacking until they were presented. It is too late for a point that the president didn't read the results at the election meeting, but not, I'd argue, for their inclusion in the minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:58 PM Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 at 02:58 PM A variation on what George M suggested: When the minutes come up for approval next meeting, insist that the vote count be included, via an amendment to the draft minutes, since that is what the rules (RONR) call for. I don't think this is "too late" as a point of order about a rule violation because you have no knowledge that the minutes were lacking until they were presented. It is too late for a point that the president didn't read the results at the election meeting, but not, I'd argue, for their inclusion in the minutes. Yes, I think offering a correction to the minutes is indeed proper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weldon Merritt Posted May 27, 2015 at 03:29 PM Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 at 03:29 PM Yes, I think offering a correction to the minutes is indeed proper. I agree that the tellers' report should be included in the minutes, but doesn't that assume that a tellers' report was presented? If all that was reported was who won, then it seems to me that there is no other report to enter. We often tell others that the minutes should reflect what actually happened, not what should have happened, so why would this be any different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstackpo Posted May 27, 2015 at 03:55 PM Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 at 03:55 PM Presumably the votes were tabulated and a (private, unfortunately) record was made. Whether reported or not, the record belongs in the minutes. (Can I Chapter & Verse that? Nope.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hieu H. Huynh Posted May 27, 2015 at 04:33 PM Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 at 04:33 PM "The tellers' report is entered in full in the minutes, becoming a part of the official records of the organization. Under no circumstances should this be omitted in an election. . ." (p. 418, ll. 26-28) Regarding the content of the minutes, "When a count has been ordered or the vote is by ballot, the number of votes on each side should be entered. . ." (p. 470, ll. 29-30) There doesn't seem to be a requirement that the counts be said in order to include them in the minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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