Adherence to rules

[Guest Boo]

What to do in a group of people who several are of the mind that 'we've always done it this way' about using first names as opposed to something less personal and casual.

These people say they want to follow Robert's Rules (and that 'they always have') and yet they seem to pick and choose some of what I see as the 'bare bones' necessary basics. I see that one measure of interpersonal formality necessary, especially ina group where things are often 'too personal' at times in how people speak either to the chair or each other.

How does one change the minds of those who ridicule the rules to make them seem unecessary, silly, or excessive, while a moment later demonstartes the need for more formality by breaching decorum?

[Hieu H. Huynh]

Perhaps everyone getting a copy of the In Brief version may be of use.

[Edgar Guest]

What to do in a group of people who several are of the mind that 'we've always done it this way' about using first names as opposed to something less personal and casual.

 

Mr.(?) Boo:

 

In many instances, there's nothing wrong with using first names. In fact, it would be socially awkward to do otherwise.

 

I try to model proper parliamentary decorum here by referring to, for example, Mr. Huynh and Mr. Martin but others are perfectly comfortable referring to, for example, Hieu and Josh. And there's nothing wrong with that.

 

See "Suggestions for Inexperienced Presiding Officers", especially p.456, ll.13-18.

[Transpower]

Boo-who?  The rules should be enforced to the degree necessary to optimize the operation of the deliberative assembly.  Robert's Rules are not ends-in-themselves; rather, they exist to help an organization run in the most efficacious  manner possible.

[Edgar Guest]

Boo-who?  The rules should be enforced to the degree necessary to optimize the operation of the deliberative assembly.  Robert's Rules are not ends-in-themselves; rather, they exist to help an organization run in the most efficacious  manner possible.

 

I'm always grateful for the opportunity to agree with Mr. Power.

[Guest Guest]

Yes, but what when intonation and influxtion is used with a first name that suggests a measure of ridicule and/or snark wishing to be delivered to the person being addressed? Especialy if this person is the chairperson and is being addressed over and over in a meeting? Wouldn't not using first names be one way to remove that tendency? Wouldn't a group that has never stuck to the rules 100% (like not even close) benefit from at least giving a bit more formality a shot, to see if there was any benefit?

[jstackpo]

If you want to require formal address in the meetings, then adopt a rule requiring it.  It would be, I would think, a "Special Rule of Order" and would require a previous notice and a 2/3 vote to adopt (or majority of entire membership).  See p. 17.   Maybe the group would stick to a rule that they adopted themselves.  It might be a start.

 

If you can't get agreement on this matter, then about all individuals can do is thicken their skins against snark and put up with it.

[Shmuel Gerber]

Yes, but what when intonation and influxtion . . .

 

Have you tried tinkering with the flux capacitor? Maybe Emmett -- excuse me, Doc Brown -- could help.

[Transpower]

OK, here's a suggestion:  Have the Chair read the following Rules of Decorum at the start of each meeting;;

 

 

R U L E S   O F   D E C O R U M

 

1.  Speakers (except for officers/committee chairs reporting) must address their remarks to the Chair, maintain a courteous tone, and avoid injecting a personal note into debate or attacking others’ motives.

 

2.  Officers and committee chairs should come to the front left or front right to present their reports and address the body.

 

3.  Speakers should refer to officers only by title and should avoid the mention of other members’ names as much as possible.

 

4.  Remarks must be germane to the question before the assembly and should not be about a prior action not pending.

 

5.  Stand when wishing to speak and when speaking, otherwise sit.

 

6.  Refrain from disturbing the assembly by whispering to one another, walking out, etc.

[Guest Guest]

OK, here's a suggestion: Have the Chair read the following Rules of Decorum at the start of each meeting;;

R U L E S O F D E C O R U M

1. Speakers (except for officers/committee chairs reporting) must address their remarks to the Chair, maintain a courteous tone, and avoid injecting a personal note into debate or attacking others’ motives.

2. Officers and committee chairs should come to the front left or front right to present their reports and address the body.

3. Speakers should refer to officers only by title and should avoid the mention of other members’ names as much as possible.

4. Remarks must be germane to the question before the assembly and should not be about a prior action not pending.

5. Stand when wishing to speak and when speaking, otherwise sit.

6. Refrain from disturbing the assembly by whispering to one another, walking out, etc.

And if we are following the "small board" rules (in regards to sitting and raising hands instead of standing)

And if when it was mentioned recently to this group by the presiding officer that we were not going to use first names anymore, several of them shook their heads and simply said 'no, we're not doing that...we've always used first names' and the presiding officer felt he had no power to insist, even though no special rule of order had ever been adopted regarding using first names in meetings.

[Edgar Guest]

And if when it was mentioned recently to this group by the presiding officer that we were not going to use first names anymore, several of them shook their heads and simply said 'no, we're not doing that...we've always used first names' and the presiding officer felt he had no power to insist, even though no special rule of order had ever been adopted regarding using first names in meetings.

 

There's nothing wrong with using first names, especially at meetings of small boards. And the president can't "insist" on not using first names if that's what the assembly wants to do.

 

If the use of first names (and other instances of informality) are your biggest complaints you should consider yourself fortunate.