Guest Betsey Frumin Posted June 13, 2015 at 06:08 PM Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 at 06:08 PM The Board designated a special committee of 4 to look into club finances. This group met for a month or a bit more and submitted a report two weeks ago. The Board now believes they must approve the report. My questions are: does the membership have the right to see the report in its original form and can the Board refuse to make the report available until they approve it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hieu H. Huynh Posted June 13, 2015 at 08:41 PM Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 at 08:41 PM I suppose the membership, by a two-thirds vote, a vote of a majority of the entire membership, or a majority vote with previous notice, could order the board to produce the report. I also suppose the board could refuse the order and be disciplined by the membership for doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Guest Posted June 13, 2015 at 08:44 PM Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 at 08:44 PM The Board now believes they must approve the report. If the report contains a recommendation then it's the recommendation that could be approved adopted (or not). Otherwise the report is simply received with no further action taken. My questions are: does the membership have the right to see the report in its original form and can the Board refuse to make the report available until they approve it.The report is the report whether the board approves it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Betsey Posted June 13, 2015 at 11:01 PM Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 at 11:01 PM Thank you for both responses. Perhaps I should have asked is this a special committee or as the Board is saying a standing committee. Here is the only mention of committees in our bylaws and I can understand the Board position if this one month finance committee would be considered a standing committee. ARTICLE V - COMMITTEESSection 1. The Board may each year establish standing committees to advance the work of the Club in such matters as obedience and agility trials, tracking tests, matches, annual prizes, membership and other fields which may well be served by committees. Such committees' action shall always be subject to the final authority of the Board. Such committees may also be appointed by the Board to aid it in particular projects. At the first meeting of the Board each year, they shall choose from among the Club members a delegate to the American Kennel Club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Lages Posted June 13, 2015 at 11:22 PM Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 at 11:22 PM It appears that your board has the authority to establish standing committees, so if the board says it's a standing committee then that's what it is. The key point about its report is that this is a committee established by the board, and therefore it reports, at least initially, to the board. As Mr. Huynh said, the membership can order the board to present the report to the membership, but that would rightfully be after the board has received the report initially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted June 13, 2015 at 11:33 PM Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 at 11:33 PM ARTICLE V - COMMITTEESSection 1. The Board may each year establish standing committees to advance the work of the Club in such matters as obedience and agility trials, tracking tests, matches, annual prizes, membership and other fields which may well be served by committees. Such committees' action shall always be subject to the final authority of the Board. Such committees may also be appointed by the Board to aid it in particular projects. At the first meeting of the Board each year, they shall choose from among the Club members a delegate to the American Kennel Club. It appears that your board has the authority to establish standing committees, so if the board says it's a standing committee then that's what it is.I'm not disagreeing with Mr. Lages, but I'm wondering if, as with other provisions in RONR, we should look to what an action does rather than what it is called. Such things as a "motion to table" the pending question and a motion to "table it until the next meeting" come to mind. We all know that the first "motion" is and should be treated as a "motion to lay on the table" and the second "motion" should be treated as a "motion to postpone to a definite time"....despite the fact that it was called a motion "to table". Rules of order and standing rules are treated the same way: we look to the effect of the rule, rather than what it is called, in deciding how it can be adopted and amended. Would this committee business be the same? A committee appointed to "aid in a particular project" as provided in the bylaws seems like it is actually a special committee rather than a standing committee.... despite the label given it in the bylaws. Comments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Guest Posted June 13, 2015 at 11:51 PM Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 at 11:51 PM I'm not disagreeing with Mr. Lages . . . Comments? Does that mean you agree with Mr. Lages? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shmuel Gerber Posted June 14, 2015 at 03:54 PM Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 at 03:54 PM Would this committee business be the same? A committee appointed to "aid in a particular project" as provided in the bylaws seems like it is actually a special committee rather than a standing committee.... despite the label given it in the bylaws. What difference does it make? A committee of the board reports to the board. It might be nice if, as Hieu suggests, the society could order the board to produce the report that the board has commissioned, but I'm not certain that is the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hieu H. Huynh Posted June 15, 2015 at 12:55 AM Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 at 12:55 AM . . . It might be nice if, as Hieu suggests, the society could order the board to produce the report that the board has commissioned, but I'm not certain that is the case. Is the uncertainty in what is said and not said in RONR? Page 460, lines 17-20 say,"The same principle applies to records kept by boards and committees, these being accessible to members of the boards or committees but to no others (but see p. 487, ll. 13-20)." Page 487, lines 13-20 say,"A record of the board's proceedings should be kept by the secretary, just as in any other assembly; these minutes are accessible only to the members of the board unless the board grants permission to a member of the society to inspect them, or unless the society by a two-thirds vote (or the vote of a majority of the total membership, or a majority vote if previous notice is given) orders the board's minutes to be produced and read to the society's assembly." It seems that RONR doesn't say that the board's records besides the minutes could be ordered by the society to be produced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shmuel Gerber Posted June 15, 2015 at 01:49 AM Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 at 01:49 AM It seems that RONR doesn't say that the board's records besides the minutes could be ordered by the society to be produced. Exactly. This might be something worth clarifying in the next edition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted June 15, 2015 at 02:44 AM Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 at 02:44 AM Is the uncertainty in what is said and not said in RONR? Page 460, lines 17-20 say,"The same principle applies to records kept by boards and committees, these being accessible to members of the boards or committees but to no others (but see p. 487, ll. 13-20)." Page 487, lines 13-20 say,"A record of the board's proceedings should be kept by the secretary, just as in any other assembly; these minutes are accessible only to the members of the board unless the board grants permission to a member of the society to inspect them, or unless the society by a two-thirds vote (or the vote of a majority of the total membership, or a majority vote if previous notice is given) orders the board's minutes to be produced and read to the society's assembly." It seems that RONR doesn't say that the board's records besides the minutes could be ordered by the society to be produced. Exactly. This might be something worth clarifying in the next edition.I think a society has the inherent authority to direct that any of its records and the records of any of its subordinate boards and committees be produced. It would be nice, though, if RONR would make that clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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