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Ajeenah

Invalidating previous quorum

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Part of a global organization, where quorum is sometimes hard to get. There was a special GA and online attendance was used, but the way that they informed members of online attendance and voting was not the most transparent but instead the Executive chose a few members to attend to ensure they reached quorum. The bylaws allow under special cases for electronic attendance.

 

Would it be possible for subsequent GA to call into question quorum and hence the decision made during that GA? If so, what would be needed in terms of votes etc?  

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At the next meeting, raise a point of order about the absence of a quorum and provide clear and convincing proof. The chair would make a ruling on the point of order and the ruling is subject to appeal.

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8 hours ago, Ajeenah said:

Part of a global organization, where quorum is sometimes hard to get. There was a special GA and online attendance was used, but the way that they informed members of online attendance and voting was not the most transparent but instead the Executive chose a few members to attend to ensure they reached quorum. The bylaws allow under special cases for electronic attendance.

 

Would it be possible for subsequent GA to call into question quorum and hence the decision made during that GA? If so, what would be needed in terms of votes etc?  

If not raised at the time, a point of order at the next meeting should be ruled as untimely by the chair, unless "clear and convincing evidence" is presented that a quorum was not present.  That's the standard in RONR.

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6 hours ago, Gary Novosielski said:

If not raised at the time, a point of order at the next meeting should be ruled as untimely by the chair, unless "clear and convincing evidence" is presented that a quorum was not present.  That's the standard in RONR.

Huh? Are you sure about that? Whether there is clear and convincing evidence goes to the burden of proof necessary to invalidate the vote taken at a previous meeting. What does it have to do with timeliness? Whether the MOTION is timely is a separate issue that has nothing to do with the evidence of whether a quorum was present. The point of order can be timely regardless of what the evidence ultimately shows. The point of order can be not well taken but still timely.

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Guest Nancy friend of cottonmout
19 hours ago, Richard Brown said:

Huh? Are you sure about that? ...

I suspect that Gary Novosielski is looking at the bottom of p. 349, where it implies, I infer, and I bet he does, that it's easier to raise a quorum question when it's happening, rather than later.  That's in the Eastern time zone, though, of course.  In Louisiana the government may have established otherwise, like the value of pi or the age of the universe or that cottonmouths are friendly and harmless and a tourist attraction.

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On 1/13/2017 at 9:43 AM, Richard Brown said:

Huh? Are you sure about that? Whether there is clear and convincing evidence goes to the burden of proof necessary to invalidate the vote taken at a previous meeting. What does it have to do with timeliness? Whether the MOTION is timely is a separate issue that has nothing to do with the evidence of whether a quorum was present. The point of order can be timely regardless of what the evidence ultimately shows. The point of order can be not well taken but still timely.

Okay, I may have bent that to the point of failure.  To make things clear, here's the actual language:

Quote

Any member noticing the apparent absence of a quorum can make a point of order to that effect at any time so long as he does not interrupt a person who is speaking. Debate on a question already pending can be allowed to continue at length after a quorum is no longer present, however, until a member raises the point. Because of the difficulty likely to be encountered in determining exactly how long the meeting has been without a quorum in such cases, a point of order relating to the absence of a quorum is generally not permitted to affect prior action; but upon clear and convincing proof, such a point of order can be given effect retrospectively by a ruling of the presiding officer, subject to appeal (24).

That's a bit unusual, though, because many points of order may interrupt a member who is speaking.

Beyond the current meeting, a point of order relating to quorum is subject to the continuing breach test as with any other point of order.

 

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