Church Members Want to Override Council’s Vote

[Guest Pastor Jeremy]

My Church Council voted to NOT bring a worship arts candidate before the congregation for a vote to hire. The By-Laws require an unanimous vote by the Council in order to do so; the vote was 6 for and 2 against. Our annual business meeting is coming up and there are church members who want to make a motion to override the Council’s vote and present the candidate to the congregation for a vote to hire. Does Robert’s Rules of Order address this issue?

[Chris Harrison]

The details you gave us are a bit unclear.  Is a unanimous vote by the Council required to present the candidate to the congregation?  Or is the default position that the Council presents the candidate to the congregation UNLESS they decided by a unanimous vote not to do so?  Also, do the Bylaws allow the congregation to hire someone without it necessarily having to go through the Council?

[Atul Kapur]

It sounds like your bylaws explain the particular relationship between your council and your congregation, so the answer is likely to be found there.

RONR generally has the assembly has boards and committees as reporting to and subordinate to the association.

[Gary Novosielski]

12 hours ago, Guest Pastor Jeremy said:

My Church Council voted to NOT bring a worship arts candidate before the congregation for a vote to hire. The By-Laws require an unanimous vote by the Council in order to do so; the vote was 6 for and 2 against. Our annual business meeting is coming up and there are church members who want to make a motion to override the Council’s vote and present the candidate to the congregation for a vote to hire. Does Robert’s Rules of Order address this issue?

If I'm reading this correctly, the bylaws require a unanimous vote of the Council to hire a candidate on their own authority without bringing the question to the congregation in general.

So, based on the information provided, it appears that the Council has exceeded its authority and, if so, a motion to Amend Something Previously Adopted would not be the appropriate method, since the action was not properly adopted.  Instead, it would be a Point of Order, that the Council's action conflicts with the bylaws and that their decision is therefore null and void.

Be prepared, in the event that the chair rules against this point of order, to raise an Appeal, and have someone prepared to second the Appeal.  This places the question on whether the ruling is correct or not before the congregation as a whole.  You should familiarize yourself with §§ 23 and 24 of RONR 12th ed.  And rather than springing it on the assembly at the annual meeting, have some informal conversations with other members so they won't be bewildered when the time comes, and will anticipate, understand, and hopefully support your course of action.

Ultimately, it is the organization as a whole that has the power to interpret, and the duty to enforce, its bylaws.

[Josh Martin]

14 hours ago, Guest Pastor Jeremy said:

My Church Council voted to NOT bring a worship arts candidate before the congregation for a vote to hire. The By-Laws require an unanimous vote by the Council in order to do so; the vote was 6 for and 2 against. Our annual business meeting is coming up and there are church members who want to make a motion to override the Council’s vote and present the candidate to the congregation for a vote to hire. Does Robert’s Rules of Order address this issue?

The details of your rules are unclear based on the summary. Please provide exactly what your bylaws say on this matter.

What Robert's Rules of Order says on this subject generally is the following:

"Except in matters placed by the bylaws exclusively under the control of the board, the society’s assembly can give the board instructions which it must carry out, and can rescind or amend any action of the board if it is not too late (see 35)." RONR (12th ed.) 49:7

So as a general matter, the church congregation could "override the Council’s vote and present the candidate to the congregation for a vote to hire," but I think it will be necessary to know what your bylaws say on this subject to provide a definitive answer to this question.

Edited September 26, 2020 at 03:02 PM by Josh Martin

[Richard Brown]

My understanding of this situation is different from that of Mr. Novosielski. It is my understanding that hiring someone for this position is a two-step process. First, the church council must vote unanimously to recommend hiring the end of visual. Second, the congregation itself most vote to hire the individual.

While I agree that normally the membership could give instructions to the board or override a board decision, I’m not sure that is the situation here. It is reasonable to interpret this bylaw provision as a qualification for holding office, namely, a candidate must first receive the unanimous approval of the church council In order to be considered by the membership for the position. Failing to receive a unanimous vote of the church council would render the candidate unqualified and the membership would not be able tooverride that determination. 

in conclusion, I believe this is ultimately a matter of bylaws interpretation, something this society must do for itself. However, I agree with Mr. Martin that if we are provided with the exact wording of this provision, we might be able to provide some guidance.