Declaring Failure of Bylaw Amendments Adoption

[rlecats]

At my organization's annual meeting this past Saturday, proposed amendments to the bylaws were introduced by the Bylaws Committee.  The presiding officer gave voting options of "yes" and "no" (although this parliamentarian advised her that "no" votes were irrelevant). As a result, she declared adoption upon a majority vote and not 2/3.   When reading the minutes of the meeting today, this parliamentarian noticed that one amendment was declared "adopted" by majority vote when it had actually had failed by 2/3 vote (the 2/3 percentage of voting members present was never announced). 

My question is, can the amendment be considered failed after the fact or does the presiding officer's declaration of the majority vote during the meeting stand?

Thank you!

Edited October 5, 2020 at 06:48 PM by rlecats

[Joshua Katz]

13 minutes ago, rlecats said:

The presiding officer gave voting options of "yes" and "no" (although this parliamentarian advised her that "no" votes were irrelevant).

This sounds like a statement about elections. No votes are certainly relevant on main motions.

13 minutes ago, rlecats said:

As a result, she declared adoption upon a majority vote and not 2/3.

I don't see how that results from calling for the no votes. It's simply a mistake.

14 minutes ago, rlecats said:

When reading the minutes of the meeting today, this parliamentarian noticed that one amendment was declared "adopted" by majority vote when it had actually had failed by 2/3 vote (the 2/3 percentage of voting members present was never announced). 

That's what the minutes say, but what happened at the meeting?

[Atul Kapur]

 

1 hour ago, rlecats said:

As a result, she declared adoption upon a majority vote and not 2/3.

A Point of Order regarding this mistake by the chair needs to be raised in a timely manner. It is too late, now, to consider the amendment "failed after the fact."

[Josh Martin]

2 hours ago, rlecats said:

The presiding officer gave voting options of "yes" and "no"

Those are the correct options.

2 hours ago, rlecats said:

(although this parliamentarian advised her that "no" votes were irrelevant)

On what basis was this advice given? What is the exact wording in your bylaws for the requirement for adoption of bylaw amendments?

2 hours ago, rlecats said:

My question is, can the amendment be considered failed after the fact or does the presiding officer's declaration of the majority vote during the meeting stand?

The presiding officer's declaration that the motion was adopted stands. A Point of Order regarding this error would need to have been raised at the time.

(This response assumes that the minutes are an accurate record of what happened at the meeting.)

[J. J.]

Presumably, the vote was not taken by ballot?

[Gary Novosielski]

On 10/5/2020 at 2:46 PM, rlecats said:

At my organization's annual meeting this past Saturday, proposed amendments to the bylaws were introduced by the Bylaws Committee.  The presiding officer gave voting options of "yes" and "no" (although this parliamentarian advised her that "no" votes were irrelevant). As a result, she declared adoption upon a majority vote and not 2/3.   When reading the minutes of the meeting today, this parliamentarian noticed that one amendment was declared "adopted" by majority vote when it had actually had failed by 2/3 vote (the 2/3 percentage of voting members present was never announced). 

My question is, can the amendment be considered failed after the fact or does the presiding officer's declaration of the majority vote during the meeting stand?

Thank you!

It sounds as though you're assuming that a 2/3 vote means 2/3 of the members present, which is not the case unless you have a bylaws provision you haven't mentioned.  Otherwise, the No votes certainly would matter.  

If the vote count actually appeared in the minutes, what was the voting method used?

[Richard Brown]

@rlecats, We need additional information. Six days ago Josh Martin asked you for the exact wording in your bylaws as to the vote required for adoption of a bylaw amendment. You have not responded. Others have asked you for the manner in which the vote was taken. You have not responded to those questions either.

In order to give you good advice and to tell you what was and was not done correctly, we need answers to some of those questions, particularly the EXACT WORDING from your bylaws regarding the vote required to adopt an amendment and also the manner in which this vote was taken.