ByLaw Presumed Correct

[Guest Jason Kahl]

When I went to the Local Zoning Board, I was told that the "Current Zoning" is Presumed Correct. If I wanted a Change I would have to explain the Error or Enough Change in Circumstance to require a Change.

Can I extend this to a Bylaw? Can the Bylaw be "Presumed" Correct?

 

I belong to a National Org, 45 pages of Changes...Most are Ridiculous and just Change for the sake of Change.

[Richard Brown]

Guest Jason, I’m not really sure what your question is, but I think it is safe to say that your bylaws say whatever it is they say, and that it is ultimately up to the membership of the organization to interpret it’s bylaws. I think they are indeed presumed to be correct until a Point of Order is raised that they are not correct. Even then, the presumption is probably that they are correct and the person challenging them must prove to the satisfaction of the chair or the assembly that they are not correct in some fashion.

can you be a bit more specific as to exactly what you mean and why you are asking the question?

[Guest Jason Kahl]

" I think they are indeed presumed to be correct until a Point of Order is raised that they are not correct. Even then, the presumption is probably that they are correct and the person challenging them must prove to the satisfaction of the chair or the assembly that they are not correct in some fashion."

A bylaw is not presumed correct here, a change can be done by the will of the submitter without explanation, There is a process on the Local Level to approve a bylaw change and submit it to National. You can submit a change without having to explain why or what is there is wrong.

[Atul Kapur]

On 7/8/2024 at 7:26 PM, Guest Jason Kahl said:

Changes...Most are Ridiculous and just Change for the sake of Change.

This is the purpose of debate: for the supporters of the change to argue its benefits and the opponents the opposite. It sounds like you will be saying, during debate, that the proposed changes are not worth the time and effort of making them.

The "presumed correct" principle is not used in parliamentary procedure in those words, but bylaws amendments usually have a higher threshold to be adopted than most motions, often requiring notice and a ⅔ vote.

[Joshua Katz]

On 7/8/2024 at 5:12 PM, Guest Jason Kahl said:

A bylaw is not presumed correct here, a change can be done by the will of the submitter without explanation, There is a process on the Local Level to approve a bylaw change and submit it to National. You can submit a change without having to explain why or what is there is wrong.

There is a difference, though, between "submit[ting] a change" and "a change [being] done." It's typically the case that anyone can propose things, and the body can accept or reject. 

Can I ask, in simple language, what the problem is here that you're looking to solve?

[Richard Brown]

On 7/8/2024 at 7:12 PM, Guest Jason Kahl said:

A bylaw is not presumed correct here,

No, a bylaw provision contained in the bylaws which are part of the Secretary's records is indeed presumed to be correct.  Perhaps you are referring to a proposed bylaw provision or something else, but the bylaws contained in the secretary's records are presumed to be correct.  That presumption, however, is a rebuttable presumption and can be declared invalid or null and void if properly challenged.

On 7/8/2024 at 7:12 PM, Guest Jason Kahl said:

a change can be done by the will of the submitter without explanation,

Unless you have VERY unusual bylaws, bylaw changes can be PROPOSED by any member, but must first be adopted by the assembly or proper body and must be subject to debate.  Unless you have VERY unusual bylaws, one person cannot arbitrarily changed "at the will of the submitter without explanation".   You yourself even admitted that the proposed changes must be adopted in order to become part of the bylaws.  Also, once a proposed bylaw amendment is on the floor for consideration, it is no longer "the property" of the member who proposed it but is the property of the assembly and the assembly must approve any changes.  The "submitter" cannot change it at will once it has been moved and seconded and stated by the chair.