Rules of Debate

[Guest jzad03]

I was under the impression that RONR's rules governing debate essentially allowed everyone to speak twice on the same day, on the same topic, for no more than 10 minutes each time. However, a member with an opposing view point at the annual convention is saying that RONR sets the rules of debate for 2 minutes per person, speaking only once on a topic on the same day, and that if a member speaks in the affirmative, then the next must be in the negative, and if there is no one to speak in the negative then debate is over. I can find this no where in the rules, but would be amazed if the opposing member was completely making these rules up. Anyone care to comment on that?

Also, Orders of the Day concerning a change to the rules of debate as described in our Policies and Procedures. What are the requirements to change our debate rules through an Order of the Day and how would it be defeated?

[George Mervosh]

1) Your impression is correct but your member may be quoting a rule your organization has in place or adopted at the start of the Convention? RONR does encourage alternating debate between the affirmative and negative if practical or possible.

2) You lost me. I don't understand your questions, but rules regarding debate can generally be suspended (p.252) or amended (p. 293ff)

[Guest jzad03]

George--

There are no rules requiring alternation during debate in any of our Policies/Procedures/Bylaws. Where does RONR encourage the alternating b/t aff & neg?

Finally, orders of the day can be used to set the limits of debate for a convention or meeting, but I Was under the impression that they must be adopted by a 2/3 vote with notice. IF this is so then how much notice must be given according to RONR?

[George Mervosh]

1) RONR, p. 367 #4

2) To alter/set the rules of debate for a Convention a 2/3 vote is required. Typically it's done when the Convention adopts all of its standing rules. No previous notice required. RONR uses "Orders of the Day" to mean something else.

[Guest jzad03]

Thank you George!! Much obliged.

Finally, in regards to the alternating rule, have you ever seen anything in the rules that states if only one side (aff or neg) is being spoken for and an opposing view point is not being represented by a speaker, that only one member of the speaking side is able to be heard before debate is ended?

[Guest jzad03]

Another question:

Our Policies state that each person gets 3 minutes to speak once, on any one subject for that day, EXCEPT as provided in an Order of the Day or by majority vote. I'm fairly certain that the majority vote is relating to a motion to extend or limit debate. However, I was curious as to how an Order of the Day would fit into this situation.

How can an Order of the Day, according to RONR, be used to modify the limits/rules of debate of an organization? Is notice required, what vote is required for it to pass, etc. Any ideas?

[George Mervosh]

Thank you George!! Much obliged.

Finally, in regards to the alternating rule, have you ever seen anything in the rules that states if only one side (aff or neg) is being spoken for and an opposing view point is not being represented by a speaker, that only one member of the speaking side is able to be heard before debate is ended?

No way.

[Kim Goldsworthy]

Our Policies state that each person gets 3 minutes to speak once, on any one subject for that day, EXCEPT as provided in an Order of the Day or by majority vote.

That is weird.

There is no relationship between "orders of the day" and "debate".

You guys are mis-using the legitimate Robertian "Orders of the Day" in a strange, unique way.

So no answer is possible - you've jumped outside of Robert's Rules by twisting and distorting an otherwise simple and clear motion.

I'm fairly certain that the majority vote is relating to a motion to extend or limit debate. However, I was curious as to how an Order of the Day would fit into this situation.

(A.) How can an Order of the Day, according to RONR, be used to modify the limits/rules of debate of an organization?

(B.) Is notice required, what vote is required for it to pass, etc.

A. - It can't. See my answer above.

B. - You mean, for "Orders of the Day" to be used "to limit debate"? It can't. So no vote is possible.

If you wish to limit debate or extend the limits of debate, there is already a perfectly fine motion in Robert's Rules of Order. Use that motion instead.

By using the proper motion, you will have side-stepped all this ambiguous nonsense of kludging the wrong motion into the wrong procedural hole.

[Guest jzad03]

I understand Kim. Again, I apologize for failing to grasp the rules as well as you have. I will make sure to fully understand the answer to my question before I ask it next time.

I did find that Orders of the Day can interfere with debate limits if an item was rescheduled for a certain time and it would take precedence over any debate that might be going on at the predetermined time for the Order of the Day.

Again, thanks for everyone's comments.

[Shmuel Gerber]

I will make sure to fully understand the answer to my question before I ask it next time.

Hey, what a great idea! Might put some of us out of a hobby, though. :-)

[David A Foulkes]

I will make sure to fully understand the answer to my question before I ask it next time.

Which does sort of make the asking a bit pointless, eh???

[Josh Martin]

I did find that Orders of the Day can interfere with debate limits if an item was rescheduled for a certain time and it would take precedence over any debate that might be going on at the predetermined time for the Order of the Day.

I can see now how you got Orders of the Day mixed into this, but the rules relating to special orders are not relevant to this particular situation. As Mr. Goldsworthy noted, the correct motion is the motion to Limit or Extend Limits of Debate.