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To stop election or to not?


farmersdaughter

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Our POA board elections are really heating up. Of course we have been working hard for a whole year to campain to change the current board. Now we are down to the wire ( ballots to be counted on 09/18/10)and thing are getting bad. First the group of member running against the current board were told they could NOT put up signs as they were against our Deed restrictions so we did not. However over the holiday weekend the current board hosted a party using the membership clubhouse. The place was covered with signs as soon as you entered the park. I was out of town however I recieved at last 20 calls from upset ppls , so I put a call into the current president and he said he would handle it. I can back into town on Monday and headed to the park to find all the signs still up. The president did not address the sign as they are all still up. Now the damage is done how do we go back? The president has not or will not return any of my calls. Second issue is the ballots were to be mailed out no later then Sept 1st according to the by-laws. I personally have still not received mine , I had already sent out my campaine letter which included a message of if you dont receive your ballot by 9/7 please call including my number. When I returned from work I had 53 message on my answering machine and I took another 27 when I got home. I gave them the nomiation directors home phone number and told them to call her. Several ppls called me back and said that the director said she would send them out a new one right away. Ok here is a problem... the ballots are not number controlled in anyway so how will they know if someone really did get a ballot and now has an extra ballot? Several ppls stopped by my home to show me the ballots , they were all upset with the how the names were listed on the ballot. Now I have not found anything in RRO that address accoutblity of the ballots or how the names are to be listed. I would assume that the names are to be listed alphabetical order. However they were listed with all the returning board members listed first. I know this is a whole lot to take in but what should be our next move , some members wants to wait and see how the election goes then call foul or I am in favor of stopping it now.... The by-laws do not address any of this issue. Just so you all know I have called an attorney and have an appointment. ANY HELP WOULD BE WONDERFUL....please excuse the typos as I am really pissed off....

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ANY HELP WOULD BE WONDERFUL....please excuse the typos as I am really pissed off....

Help us to help you:

Please ask a question.

Make the question one which can be answered by citing a page from Robert's Rules of Order Newly Revised (RONR 10th ed. 2000).

Don't ask us about customized rules, like your bylaws. No one has read your bylaws.

This Q&A Forum is not the place to opine on bylaws, unless the wording matches RONR in word or deed, or unless your bylaws are silent on the issue in question.

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Help us to help you:

Please ask a question.

Make the question one which can be answered by citing a page from Robert's Rules of Order Newly Revised (RONR 10th ed. 2000).

Don't ask us about customized rules, like your bylaws. No one has read your bylaws.

This Q&A Forum is not the place to opine on bylaws, unless the wording matches RONR in word or deed, or unless your bylaws are silent on the issue in question.

Ok

# Is there anything in RRO that should be followed on how the ballot should be controled?

# IS there anything in RRO that says the order of how ppls are to be listed on the ballot?

# Is ther anything in RRO on how we should handle stopping the election?

Our by-laws do NOT address any of this issues

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# Is there anything in RRO that should be followed on how the ballot should be controled?

RONR describes a "double envelope" procedure on p.410.

# IS there anything in RRO that says the order of how ppls are to be listed on the ballot?

No, that's for each organization to determine, though some here suggest they be listed in the order in which they were nominated. Alphabetical order is the most neutral but it's not uncommon to list incumbents first

# Is ther anything in RRO on how we should handle stopping the election?

Our by-laws do NOT address any of this issues

I'm not sure that anything done so far is cause for stopping the election. But you might challenge the ballots if you think that some members may have voted more than once.

And note that the organization's responsibility is to send the ballots on time. Whether they're received on time is out of its control.

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Our POA board elections are really heating up.

Of course we have been working hard for a whole year to campaign to change the current board.

Now we are down to the wire (ballots to be counted on 09/18/10) and thing are getting bad.

This is non-essential information. It just creates clutter for the eye, and makes finding the issue-related text harder to find, embedded in fluff and distractions.

First the group of member running against the current board were told they could NOT put up signs as they were against our deed restrictions so we did not.

However over the holiday weekend the current board hosted a party using the membership clubhouse.

The place was covered with signs as soon as you entered the park.

I was out of town however I received at last 20 calls from upset ppls, so I put a call into the current president and he said he would handle it.

I can back into town on Monday and headed to the park to find all the signs still up.

The president did not address the signs as they are all still up.

Now the damage is done. How do we go back?

You have a "sign" problem?

• There is no "damage" done.

• There is nothing to "go back" to.

Signs (the use of; the lack of;) are not a parliamentary problem addressed by Robert's Rules of Order.

So no pages citation is even possible.

No violation has occurred.

"Deed restrictions" are up to you. I/we cannot answer questions on deed restrictions. Consult your favorite attorney for fine legal advice, if deed restrictions are your focus.

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RONR describes a "double envelope" procedure on p.410.

No, that's for each organization to determine, though some here suggest they be listed in the order in which they were nominated. Alphabetical order is the most neutral but it's not uncommon to list incumbents first

I'm not sure that anything done so far is cause for stopping the election. But you might challenge the ballots if you think that some members may have voted more than once.

And note that the organization's responsibility is to send the ballots on time. Whether they're received on time is out of its control.

That is the one worry , if someone can just call up and state they have not received their ballot and she will sent them out another one right away.. How can we be sure that other members that want to see the current board gets re-elected has not called and got more ballots to mail in?

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How can we be sure that other members that want to see the current board gets re-elected has not called and got more ballots to mail in?

I'm afraid that's for your organization to figure out. No offense, but it's not rocket science and yours is not the first organization to have mail-in ballots. You could always contact another POA and see how they do it.

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I spent several days reading through years of mintues from the POA meetings. Mintues of a meeting in Aug 1999 takes about control numbers on the ballots. Who was going to be on the committee to cross check the control numbers with the membership list. So I know for a fact now that control number were used at one time. So it appears when the board took over in 2000 they no longer used control numbers. I really think we are going to stop the election and start over with control numbers ballots , as that would be the fairest way. I will try to find a POA that is like ours to contact them . Thanks for your help :rolleyes:

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A little thought or two.

1, Do you trust the nominations director? Do you trust the tellers committee (p. 400, p. 410 -- see how easy it is, Kim?)? -- Do they have a list of legal voters, to compare with the received ballots?

2. As Kim says in his exuberant sunny way, "Signs (the use of; the lack of;) are not a parliamentary problem addressed by Robert's Rules of Order.

So no pages citation is even possible.

No violation has occurred."

-- So go put up your own signs, quick. Or, actually check the deed restrictions and see if the Power Structure's signs violated them. And if so, nail them on it.

3. I myself like the personal touch that Farmer's Daughter gives her posts by revealing that she and her allies have been working hard, and that she is pissed off (which I presume is an American expression indicating distress with some degree of indelicacy), but to which Kim objects. But I am perhaps a scented-lace-doily-sniffing effete Eastern type while Kim is a hands-on no-nonsense meat-and-potatoes man, so, as Kim would say while brandishing his parliamentary shillelagh, de gustibus non est disputandum. Meaning, write whatever you want, farmersdaughter, let Kim kvetch. "Fluff and distractions"?? Feh -- you should see how he dresses for work.

4. I'm on the fence about whether it would be fairer, or more efficient, or both, to stop a fatally flawed election process as soon as possible, or let it go on and then try to get the whole thing thrown out. I'd bet, but not much, that it's tactically more prudent to start fighting as soon as possible. But I'm not a Californian, so I have my grouchy moments.

Nancy N.

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