Recording individual negative vote in minutes

[phildee]

At a board meeting, a voice vote is taken on a motion. The motion is passed. One member has requested that the minutes show that he voted "no". Is it proper to note this request in the minutes?

[Gary Novosielski]

At a board meeting, a voice vote is taken on a motion. The motion is passed. One member has requested that the minutes show that he voted "no". Is it proper to note this request in the minutes?

With the permission of the board.

[Rob Elsman]

At a board meeting, a voice vote is taken on a motion. The motion is passed. One member has requested that the minutes show that he voted "no". Is it proper to note this request in the minutes?

In the general case, no. The minutes are the official record of the actions taken by the assembly, not the personal journal of an individual member. This kind of request is dilatory in the general case and should not be made. It is invariably made by a member on the losing side in lieu of a proper action to bring the question back before the assembly. Rather than making such a request, the member might want to make a motion to Rescind, give notice of a motion to Rescind, or seek to find a member who is qualified to make a motion to Reconsider.

[Tim Wynn]

In the general case, no. The minutes are the official record of the actions taken by the assembly, not the personal journal of an individual member. This kind of request is dilatory in the general case and should not be made. It is invariably made by a member on the losing side in lieu of a proper action to bring the question back before the assembly. Rather than making such a request, the member might want to make a motion to Rescind, give notice of a motion to Rescind, or seek to find a member who is qualified to make a motion to Reconsider.

I think Mr. Elsman has provided an excellent answer, and, as I currently have no red herring to drag into view, I'll just endorse his response.

[Gary Novosielski]

In the general case, no. The minutes are the official record of the actions taken by the assembly, not the personal journal of an individual member. This kind of request is dilatory in the general case and should not be made. It is invariably made by a member on the losing side in lieu of a proper action to bring the question back before the assembly. Rather than making such a request, the member might want to make a motion to Rescind, give notice of a motion to Rescind, or seek to find a member who is qualified to make a motion to Reconsider.

Well, he could have done all of those things, but if he acted quickly at the time where this vote occurred, he need not have attempted to bring the motion again before the assembly.

Since it was his desire merely to have his vote recorded, he might have made a timely motion for a recorded (roll-call) vote which, being a motion affecting the method of voting, would have required majority concurrence of the board. (Hence my admittedly abbreviated former response.) In a small board meeting, a roll call would not be much of a hardship, if ordered.

It is quite correct that an individual member cannot demand this, but the mechanism exists for a member who wishes to be on record as having voted a certain way to accomplish this goal, by moving to have the votes of ALL members recorded. RONR notes that, unless members are representatives of a constituency, this type of vote is not really appropriate, but if the board in this scenario were an elected one, it well might be.

The motions to Rescind or to Reconsider would not have accomplished his goal of being on record in opposition.

[phildee]

It is quite correct that an individual member cannot demand this, but the mechanism exists for a member who wishes to be on record as having voted a certain way to accomplish this goal, by moving to have the votes of ALL members recorded. RONR notes that, unless members are representatives of a constituency, this type of vote is not really appropriate, but if the board in this scenario were an elected one, it well might be.

The motions to Rescind or to Reconsider would not have accomplished his goal of being on record in opposition.

Thanx everyone for your replies...much appreciated. I would concur with the final statement - unless there was a roll call vote, I don't know how the motions to Rescind or Reconsider would have got that person's name on record.

Can I sneak in a question about roll call vote?? With the main motion on the floor, is it proper to call for a roll-call vote? Is this OK when there is a main motion already on the floor?

[Tim Wynn]

Can I sneak in a question about roll call vote?? With the main motion on the floor, is it proper to call for a roll-call vote? Is this OK when there is a main motion already on the floor?

Absolutely.

[David A Foulkes]

Absolutely.

Well, it "should not be used in a mass meeting or in any assembly whose members are not responsible to a constituency." (p. 405 l. 20-22)

And, in "local societies having a large membership but relatively small attendance at meetings, a motion to take a vote by roll call is generally dilatory." (p. 405 ll. 32-35)

Other than that.......I tend to agree with Mr. Wynn's viewpoints fairly often.

[Tim Wynn]

Well, it "should not be used in a mass meeting or in any assembly whose members are not responsible to a constituency." (p. 405 l. 20-22)

And, in "local societies having a large membership but relatively small attendance at meetings, a motion to take a vote by roll call is generally dilatory." (p. 405 ll. 32-35)

Other than that.......I tend to agree with Mr. Wynn's viewpoints fairly often.

I took it to be a question on whether an applicable incidental motion takes precedence over a main motion to which it is applied. I'm confident, though, that your citations will be as educational, if not more, to phildee.

[David A Foulkes]

I took it to be a question on whether an applicable incidental motion takes precedence over a main motion to which it is applied. I'm confident, though, that your citations will be as educational, if not more, to phildee.

Yes, I see your thinking. I took it to be a question on whether moving for a roll call vote, as opposed to ballot or other method, was appropriate. Perhaps phildee will enlighten us.

[phildee]

Yes, I see your thinking. I took it to be a question on whether moving for a roll call vote, as opposed to ballot or other method, was appropriate. Perhaps phildee will enlighten us.

Perhaps this is my answer...

From Page 273

Incidental motions relating to methods of voting and the polls:

1. Take precedence over the motion being voted on or to be voted on. When applied to a vote which has just been taken, they can be moved until, but not after, the question on another motion has been stated. They can be moved while an order for the Previous Question is in effect on the votes to which they apply. They yield to the privileged motions, and to a motion to Lay on the Table moved while the question to which they are applied is pending. It is not in order to move that the same question be voted on again under one of the other forms.

[page 274]

2. Can be applied to any motion on which the assembly is called upon to vote. No subsidiary motion can be applied to them except Amend .*

3. Are out of order when another has the floor.

4. Must be seconded.

5. Are not debatable.

6. Are amendable.

7. Require a majority vote, except a motion to close the polls, which requires a two-thirds vote.

8. Can be reconsidered, except a motion to close the polls, or an affirmative vote on a motion to reopen the polls. (In the latter cases, the same effect can be obtained by renewal or by the opposite motion.)