Can't believe you don't have to obtain the floor - casual rules

[Guest loose]

I just read a small footprint in the RRONR says on a small board (informal rules) you don't have to obtain the floor before speaking (when a motion is pending). You gotta be kiddin'. How are people supposed to speak unharrassed when differences of opinion are heated?

[Larry Cisar]

I just read a small footprint in the RRONR says on a small board (informal rules) you don't have to obtain the floor before speaking (when a motion is pending). You gotta be kiddin'. How are people supposed to speak unharrassed when differences of opinion are heated?

That footnote does not mean that you can interrupt a person who is speaking. It does mean that when nobody is speaking, you do not have to go through the formality of getting the floor. Now, if things become heated, the group should go to the more formal rules.

[David A Foulkes]

Also, although the rules are relaxed that does not mean they aren't still in force. The chair still has the responsibility to "control" things, and if a member is being unruly, could/should still be called to order (by the chair or another member), and may even be ejected from the meeting. Good behavior does not get left at the door.

[tctheatc]

it's always easier to start out rigid on the rules and lighten up than it is to start out lax and tighten 'em up when needed.

[Guest loose]

That footnote does not mean that you can interrupt a person who is speaking. It does mean that when nobody is speaking, you do not have to go through the formality of getting the floor. Now, if things become heated, the group should go to the more formal rules.

[Guest loose]

Can't tell you how relieved I am to have that cleared up. Thanks!

[Guest loose]

it's always easier to start out rigid on the rules and lighten up than it is to start out lax and tighten 'em up when needed.

[Guest loose]

Do you mean, as a board, it is easier to start out formal until the group learns the ropes? This board has always been small and never learned how to operate per RR. I'm working towards getting group to accept having a parliamentarian come in for a few mock meetings. Thanks for the concept.

[Guest loose]

Also, although the rules are relaxed that does not mean they aren't still in force. The chair still has the responsibility to "control" things, and if a member is being unruly, could/should still be called to order (by the chair or another member), and may even be ejected from the meeting. Good behavior does not get left at the door.

[Guest loose]

I think I see what you mean. Let the "spirit of the law" be the guide? I just would like to speak without worrying that every time I take a breath someone's going to jump in with, "but, but, but, but, but, but" - makes it hard to think. That's why standing is so useful (indicates you're still talking), but "stilted" in a small group.

[Trina]

I think I see what you mean. Let the "spirit of the law" be the guide? I just would like to speak without worrying that every time I take a breath someone's going to jump in with, "but, but, but, but, but, but" - makes it hard to think. That's why standing is so useful (indicates you're still talking), but "stilted" in a small group.

If some of the members have not yet mastered the informal art of waiting to take their turns in conversation (my Kindergartner is still working on this, but I have been hoping -- perhaps in vain -- that he'll have that concept down by the time he's an adult), it sounds like you do need more formality

[Dan Honemann]

If some of the members have not yet mastered the informal art of waiting to take their turns in conversation (my Kindergartner is still working on this, but I have been hoping -- perhaps in vain -- that he'll have that concept down by the time he's an adult), it sounds like you do need more formality

Truth be told, I think loose may have some reasonable grounds for concern.

[Josh Martin]

Do you mean, as a board, it is easier to start out formal until the group learns the ropes?

I'm not sure exactly what tctheatc was getting at, but I would not make this as a blanket statement for all boards, although it may be necessary in your case.

Let the "spirit of the law" be the guide?

I believe Mr. Foulkes' point was simply that "relaxed rules" doesn't mean "no rules."

[tctheatc]

Do you mean, as a board, it is easier to start out formal until the group learns the ropes? This board has always been small and never learned how to operate per RR. I'm working towards getting group to accept having a parliamentarian come in for a few mock meetings. Thanks for the concept.

Not necessarily. It's a general concept; apply it to your own situation at your own peril. Not knowing your board I wouldn't presume to suggest what would be 'easier" or "right" or "effective" for them. I've been an air traffic controller for 20 yrs and we have LOTS of complicated rules that make RONR look like abc's. When I train a new controller, I demand they know the rules and know them cold and know how to apply them. And I know there are times to maybe "stretch" the limits of the rules and I teach that, too. But I stress that you gotta know the rules before you can break, er stretch them, y'know? Some don't get that. They see a vet stretching the rules and think "I can do that, too" but it's dangerous when one's rushing right to the end product without the basics. learn the rules before you relax them, otherwise you're "learning" relaxed what? Certainly not rules. You're "learning" something other than the rules.

In my experience in small boards and such (e.g. churches, I'm a minister, too) it's fine to say the rules are relaxed, but if people don't comprehend the concept of "one thing/motion at a time" it doesn't work. people talk without obtaining the floor, several concepts are being bandied about, and when it comes time to vote you have a sneaking suspicion there are a few ideas on what it is we're voting on. Of course, a good chair can help, but then again, if the chair knows the rules. The real rules. The rules you need to know before you entertain "relaxing" them.

Clear as mud,I'll bet. ;-)

[Gary c Tesser]

it's always easier to start out rigid on the rules and lighten up than it is to start out lax and tighten 'em up when needed.

I think this was the theme of the "Mirror, Mirror" episode on *Star Trek*.

(No RONR citation to back this up, darnit)