Voting by Role Call

[Guest Boris Bedenov]

When voting on motions in executive committee of an educational association with only 10 members on this committee separate from the general membership of 104 members, is it appropriate to call for a vote by roll call when you eventually want the membership to know how their individually elected committee members voted? What is the protocol to follow after the motion has been seconded in order to have the roll call vote established? What do I do if the chair does not recognize my right to call for a role call vote? If I am denied, is this supposed to show up in the minutes of the meeting or do I request that the denial be added to the minutes? Our association is in total disarray and I don't know what to expect. Oops, I know it's roll and not role!

[Larry Cisar]

When voting on motions in executive committee of an educational association with only 10 members on this committee separate from the general membership of 104 members, is it appropriate to call for a vote by roll call when you eventually want the membership to know how their individually elected committee members voted? What is the protocol to follow after the motion has been seconded in order to have the roll call vote established? What do I do if the chair does not recognize my right to call for a role call vote? If I am denied, is this supposed to show up in the minutes of the meeting or do I request that the denial be added to the minutes? Our association is in total disarray and I don't know what to expect. Oops, I know it's roll and not role!

You make the motion to have a roll call vote before voting begins. If the chair refuses to recognize it, appeal. You can only make the motion if you are a member of the body voting.

[Josh Martin]

When voting on motions in executive committee of an educational association with only 10 members on this committee separate from the general membership of 104 members, is it appropriate to call for a vote by roll call when you eventually want the membership to know how their individually elected committee members voted?

Such a motion is in order, yes.

What is the protocol to follow after the motion has been seconded in order to have the roll call vote established?

The chair should put the question on the motion for a roll call vote. A majority vote is required for adoption, and the motion is not debatable.

What do I do if the chair does not recognize my right to call for a role call vote?

If the chair rules the motion out of order, you should appeal from the decision of the chair.

If I am denied, is this supposed to show up in the minutes of the meeting or do I request that the denial be added to the minutes?

It depends on what you mean by "denied." If the chair rules the motion out of order, his ruling will be included in the minutes, along with any subsequent appeal. If the chair properly handles the motion but it is defeated, it will not be included in the minutes, nor would it be appropriate to request its inclusion. Such a request would require a majority vote for adoption anyway, so if you can't get a majority to support the motion for a roll call vote I doubt you'll have much luck with that either.

[Kim Goldsworthy]

When voting on motions in executive committee of an educational association with only 10 members on this committee separate from the general membership of 104 members, is it appropriate to call for a vote by roll call when you eventually want the membership to know how their individually elected committee members voted?

A motion to vote by a certain method (here, by roll call) is a motion, and as such, it is to be seconded, is undebatable, and takes a majority vote to adopt.

What is the protocol to follow after the motion has been seconded in order to have the roll call vote established?

Vote on it. It is not debatable. Takes a majority vote to adopt.

What do I do if the chair does not recognize my right to call for a role call vote?

Bad chairman, there!

A point of order would be in order, since the is violating the parliamentary rules to not recognize a proper motion.

If I am denied, is this supposed to show up in the minutes of the meeting or do I request that the denial be added to the minutes?

If your motion is ruled upon by the chair as being "out of order", then The Book does say that rulings of the chair are to be recorded in the minutes.

Is that what you mean?

Oops, I know it's roll and not role!

JERRY MAHONY: Mister Secretary, please call the role.

KNUCKLEHEAD SMIFF: Aye, aye, mister chairman. -- Here, roll! Here, roll!

– Winchell-Mahoney Time

"Skotty-Whotty Doo Doo!"

[David A Foulkes]

It depends on what you mean by "denied." If the chair rules the motion out of order, his ruling will be included in the minutes, along with any subsequent appeal. If the chair properly handles the motion but it is defeated, it will not be included in the minutes, nor would it be appropriate to request its inclusion. Such a request would require a majority vote for adoption anyway, so if you can't get a majority to support the motion for a roll call vote I doubt you'll have much luck with that either.

Josh - just to clarify, if Boris moves to vote by roll call (seconded) and the motion is defeated, there would be no record of it in the minutes? This is referring to item #7 on page 453 (at least as one explanatory device), yes?

[Dan Honemann]

Josh - just to clarify, if Boris moves to vote by roll call (seconded) and the motion is defeated, there would be no record of it in the minutes? This is referring to item #7 on page 453 (at least as one explanatory device), yes?

That's right, if the motion to vote by roll call is defeated, there will be no mention of it in the minutes.

I don't know why you refer to #7 on page 453.

[David A Foulkes]

That's right, if the motion to vote by roll call is defeated, there will be no mention of it in the minutes.

I don't know why you refer to #7 on page 453.

It's possible I have the page number wrong, and I'm sans livre at the moment (I know, can you believe it?). I was looking at the section on what gets included in the minutes, and #7 refers to (and I'm vague here for the moment) motions that are not lost or (something else). My take was that main motions and motions that bring business again before the assembly do get recorded regardless of disposition (#6 on page 452?). The motion to vote by roll call would not be either of those, and thus only recorded if the motion passed. (#7 on page 453)

Again, perhaps I've got the page numbers wrong, or perhaps I'm just misunderstanding what it's saying. I'll check when I return to my book tonight.

[Josh Martin]

The motion to vote by roll call would not be either of those, and thus only recorded if the motion passed. (#7 on page 453)

Item #7 on pg. 453 states that secondary motions which are not lost or withdrawn are recorded in cases where this is necessary for clarity or completeness, and the text generally only alludes to the adoption of such motions. It doesn't have much application to this particular circumstance, since no additional explanation will be necessary. The inclusion of the roll call in the minutes will make it obvious that a roll call vote was taken, either by motion or by rule, and it doesn't particularly matter which one is the case.

An example of a motion which would fall under Item #7 would be the granting of a Request to be Excused from a Duty. Since such a motion is an incidental motion, it does not fall under the other categories of motions to be recorded, but it is important that this information be noted in the minutes. Therefore, the minutes would state, for instance, that "The resignation of the Secretary was accepted."