Guest Guest289 Posted January 19, 2011 at 06:09 PM Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 at 06:09 PM I read in a previous thread that absentee ballots can not be used unless written in the bylaws.Our club had an annual election and absentee ballots were used, this was not written in the bylaws.The voting was very close. What should happen now? Should there be a re-vote?I also have another question. Who should count the ballots in an annual election? We do not have a committee appointment for that. Should people that are running for offices/board be counting the votes?Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Novosielski Posted January 19, 2011 at 06:46 PM Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 at 06:46 PM I read in a previous thread that absentee ballots can not be used unless written in the bylaws.Our club had an annual election and absentee ballots were used, this was not written in the bylaws.The voting was very close. What should happen now? Should there be a re-vote?I also have another question. Who should count the ballots in an annual election? We do not have a committee appointment for that. Should people that are running for offices/board be counting the votes?Thank youThe election was not valid. It's as if it never took place. If anyone tries to take action based on it, raise a point of order. If the chair doesn't agree, Appeal. (Majority vote can overrule the chair's decision.)There should be a committee of tellers to count the ballots, and report according to the format in RONR. The committee should be appointed by the chair, and consist of members generally considered trustworthy. Candidates, or members in general, may view the process, if the assembly wishes, but candidates should not be tellers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmtcastle Posted January 19, 2011 at 06:53 PM Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 at 06:53 PM The election was not valid. It's as if it never took place.Wouldn't that now depend on whether the number of absentee ballots could have affected the results? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Novosielski Posted January 19, 2011 at 07:16 PM Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 at 07:16 PM Wouldn't that now depend on whether the number of absentee ballots could have affected the results?Oh, yes it would. Did I miss the fact that in-person voting was also used? I jumped to the conclusion that absentee ballots were used exclusively.If only some of the votes were absentees', then if they could not have affected the outcome, the the results can stand. Or, if the absentee ballots can be identified as such, and removed from the count, you can still achieve a valid result. Do you still have the in-person ballots to recount? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest289 Posted January 19, 2011 at 07:42 PM Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 at 07:42 PM I assume that we still have the in-person ballots to recount.The vote in question is for board memembers. We have 7 board members in our club. They posted the counts of the election results including absentee and in-person votes. The counts were very close (2 votes apart). (roughly 100 people voted)Two days later they did a re-count and posted the results as a tie for the last 2 seats on the board. They than realized that absentee ballots were never in the bylaws. So than they reverted to the original numbers posted. This seems like a complete mess to me. The people that used the absentee ballots were under the impression that they were legal and their votes would count.Also the pepole that counted the votes were running for the same position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmtcastle Posted January 19, 2011 at 07:49 PM Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 at 07:49 PM This seems like a complete mess to me.Sounds about right.What's always surprising is that no one ever seems to complain at the time, when it's much easier to fix things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Novosielski Posted January 19, 2011 at 07:51 PM Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 at 07:51 PM I assume that we still have the in-person ballots to recount.The vote in question is for board memembers. We have 7 board members in our club. They posted the counts of the election results including absentee and in-person votes. The counts were very close (2 votes apart). (roughly 100 people voted)Two days later they did a re-count and posted the results as a tie for the last 2 seats on the board. They than realized that absentee ballots were never in the bylaws. So than they reverted to the original numbers posted. This seems like a complete mess to me. The people that used the absentee ballots were under the impression that they were legal and their votes would count.Also the pepole that counted the votes were running for the same position.Well, impressions notwithstanding, absentee votes cannot be counted if not provided for expressly in the bylaws. The person who gave them that impression might be the subject of a censure motion, so as to encourage that individual to check the rules before opening the mouth, next time at least.The vote counting by candidates, even if irregular, was apparently not made the subject of a point of order at the time, and constitutes no continuing breach of the rules, so that's water under the bridge.But if you can engineer a fair and accurate vote count out of this mess, you can avoid another election. Or do you not want to avoid another election? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest289 Posted January 19, 2011 at 08:29 PM Report Share Posted January 19, 2011 at 08:29 PM Yes I should have spoke up in the meeting about why people running for the board where counting the votes. I did not have a robert rules book handy. I do have one now, so this will not happen again. I will also make them aware that what they were doing was wrong.So many things were not handled correctly. They were calling people up that had absentee ballots and asking them who they voted for, because the absentee ballot that they gave them was not correct. That does not seem right to me either.Being a member of this club, I was just wondering if there was a way to force them to have a re-vote. Maybe I can bring it up at the next monthly meeting so everyone is aware of the correct rules and what should have been done.Thank you for all your help with this matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted January 20, 2011 at 04:38 AM Report Share Posted January 20, 2011 at 04:38 AM Being a member of this club, I was just wondering if there was a way to force them to have a re-vote.The way the rules work, there really isn't a choice about whether to have a re-vote. Either you have to do a re-vote or you can't. If the absentee ballots could have affected the result and it is not possible to distinguish them from the in-person ballots, you need to have a re-vote. If the absentee ballots could not have affected the result you just don't worry about it. If the absentee ballots could have affected the result but they can be distinguished from the in-person ballots, the proper course of action is to order a recount (of just the proper ballots) and use those results.If a re-vote is the proper course of action, you should raise a Point of Order that the election is null and void. If a recount is the proper course of action, make a motion to order a recount. In either case, you may Suspend the Rules to have the assembly appoint the tellers' committee if the chair is still crazy enough to have it be primarily composed of people who are on the ballot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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