Tomm Posted March 13, 2022 at 01:27 AM Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 01:27 AM The 9 member board is a divided board. 5 members are power hungry and 4 are for the general Membership. A motion will be made at the next board meeting that the good guys want to basically fail as it is written. A board member (good guy) is intending to make the motion to divide the question because 2 of the 3 proposals work against the general membership. It is expected that a bad guy will immediately move Previous Question to shut down all debate. Is there a way to thwart such a motion other than Lay on the Table? Would it be permissible to restate the motion as a new motion by eliminating the 2 bad proposals from within the original motion? BTW, this motion will be amending the Bylaws, which the board has the power to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atul Kapur Posted March 13, 2022 at 01:45 AM Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 01:45 AM It takes a 2/3 vote to order the previous question. If all 9 vote, that requires 6 votes in favour. If your favoured faction has four members, then they should simply vote against the motion to order the previous question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomm Posted March 13, 2022 at 02:39 AM Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 02:39 AM If that option fails could the motion be made again (same meeting) with the elimination of those controversial parts? Would thst be considered a new motion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted March 13, 2022 at 05:47 PM Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 05:47 PM On 3/12/2022 at 7:27 PM, Tomm said: Is there a way to thwart such a motion other than Lay on the Table? The way to thwart the motion for the Previous Question is to vote against it. The Previous Question requires a 2/3 vote for adoption. I don't know exactly what you have in mind with Lay on the Table, but it's probably improper. The following should be noted: 1.) The motion to Lay on the Table can only be applied to main motions. It can't be applied to the Previous Question. 2.) The motion to Lay on the Table is used to temporarily set a motion aside in order to take up some other urgent business. It is not used to kill a motion or to delay a motion until a certain time - there are other motions for those purposes. In the highly unusual event that Lay on the Table is being properly used for its intended purpose, such a motion requires a majority vote for adoption. On 3/12/2022 at 7:27 PM, Tomm said: Would it be permissible to restate the motion as a new motion by eliminating the 2 bad proposals from within the original motion? I cannot say with certainty since I know nothing about these proposals, but based upon the facts presented here, it seems that the new motion would be sufficiently different from the original that it would present a substantially new question. If this is correct, the new motion would be in order. "A main motion, or a motion for the same amendment to a given motion, cannot be renewed at the same session unless there is a change in wording or circumstances sufficient to present substantially a new question, in which case this becomes technically a different motion. If a series of resolutions voted on together is lost, however, one or more of them can be offered again at the same session, but enough resolutions must be left out to present a genuinely different question from the viewpoint of probable voting result; otherwise this procedure becomes dilatory." RONR (12th ed.) 38:5 On 3/12/2022 at 8:39 PM, Tomm said: If that option fails could the motion be made again (same meeting) with the elimination of those controversial parts? Would thst be considered a new motion? See above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomm Posted March 13, 2022 at 05:55 PM Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 05:55 PM On 3/13/2022 at 10:47 AM, Josh Martin said: I don't know exactly what you have in mind with Lay on the Table, but it's probably improper The only reason I mentioned Lay on the Table was it appears to be the only motion that Previous Question would yield too? The new motion would basically be the same as the original motion with 2 of three proposals removed, so I assume it would not be allowed? Best option is probably to get the 2/3rd's vote for Previous Question to fail! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted March 13, 2022 at 07:13 PM Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 07:13 PM (edited) On 3/13/2022 at 12:55 PM, Tomm said: The only reason I mentioned Lay on the Table was it appears to be the only motion that Previous Question would yield too? Okay, but how would laying the main motion on the table help? The purpose of Lay on the Table is to temporarily set aside a pending main motion in order to deal with some other urgent business. When the motion is taken from the table, it is in the same state as it was previously - that is, the Previous Question would be pending again. On 3/13/2022 at 12:55 PM, Tomm said: The new motion would basically be the same as the original motion with 2 of three proposals removed, so I assume it would not be allowed? If two out of three proposals are removed, this does not seem to be to be "basically the same" motion, in my opinion. On 3/13/2022 at 12:55 PM, Tomm said: Best option is probably to get the 2/3rd's vote for Previous Question to fail! Yes. Edited March 13, 2022 at 07:15 PM by Josh Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atul Kapur Posted March 13, 2022 at 07:14 PM Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 07:14 PM Depending on the exact wording of the main motion, a motion to divide the question may be appropriate. As per RONR (12th ed.) 27:3(1), this motion can be made even after the previous question has been ordered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomm Posted March 13, 2022 at 07:20 PM Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 07:20 PM I never intended that the motion to Table should or would be used, I was merely grasping for straws to hopefully see if some other possible motion had precedence. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomm Posted March 13, 2022 at 08:10 PM Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 08:10 PM On 3/13/2022 at 12:14 PM, Atul Kapur said: this motion can be made even after the previous question has been ordered. How does that work? I thought once the previous question is voted on it's kinda a done deal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Honemann Posted March 13, 2022 at 08:21 PM Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 08:21 PM On 3/13/2022 at 4:10 PM, Tomm said: How does that work? I thought once the previous question is voted on it's kinda a done deal? Have you read 16:2? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomm Posted March 13, 2022 at 08:27 PM Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 at 08:27 PM On 3/13/2022 at 1:21 PM, Dan Honemann said: Have you read 16:2? Ah Ha! It's an incidental motion! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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