Motion to Reconsider & Call the Previous Question order

[Sid Grice]

8 minutes ago, Guest A Brown said:

That's what is nuts.  We have an official parliamentarian sitting next to the chair.  Who has a copy of RR.

Excuse the intrusiveness of my post, but maybe directing that person to this forum may be beneficial to the organization. I have been reading this forum for awhile, and the benefits have been extremely valuable. 

 

[Joshua Katz]

35 minutes ago, Guest A Brown said:

That's what is nuts.  We have an official parliamentarian sitting next to the chair.  Who has a copy of RR.

Possession is 9/10 of the law, but not of knowledge or of practice. Oftentimes, organizations have parliamentarians who are elected, or who are members, and whose knowledge varies. But, more importantly, a parliamentarian can't really fix anything unless the chair plays along. If the chair is sure and simply goes on and does something, the parliamentarian can do little (except slide over a little stop-sign card and hope the chair pays attention). If asked, the parliamentarian advises the chair. But meetings move quickly.

 

1 hour ago, Guest A Brown said:

But someone who is unhappy with the vote cannot come back at this point and try to do something to reverse it, correct?

It's very much a side point, but I'd like to add an editorial remark here. You are right that it is too late to raise a point of order, as others have noted. But during the meeting, when this happened, when it was not too late to raise a point of order - there is no reason to suppose it should be raised, or can only be raised, by someone who is unhappy with the vote. Even someone who likes the outcome should object if the rules are not being followed, and if the manner in which they are not being followed matters to someone's rights. I have several times, perhaps often, voted against my interests on an appeal, and even once or twice raised points of order which went against my immediate interests. I would hope anyone who knows a rule is being broken would do likewise.

[jstackpo]

Yes, but has he read it?  (Sorry, that was just too easy to pass up.)

[Guest A Brown]

4 hours ago, Joshua Katz said:

It's very much a side point, but I'd like to add an editorial remark here. You are right that it is too late to raise a point of order, as others have noted. But during the meeting, when this happened, when it was not too late to raise a point of order - there is no reason to suppose it should be raised, or can only be raised, by someone who is unhappy with the vote.

Things moved so fast that I don't think people realized what was going on, and I doubt very many in attendance knew that it wasn't handled correctly.  I didn't until I rec'd the notes from someone who transcribed it (as best as they could, so take all of this with a grain of salt).  Most people are going to give the chair and parliamentarian the benefit of the doubt and assume they know what they are doing.  I am using this proposal as an example to walk future delegates through parliamentary procedure on a governance website, and that's when I realized something wasn't right.  I just wasn't sure where and exactly why it wasn't correct and reading my copy of RR didn't clear things up.   FWIW, someone made a Point of Information at one point because it became obvious delegates were confused and things were moving so quickly.  "Speaker" isn't the same person in case it's not obvious. This is not a word for word transcription.

Chair: We will now resume debate on the original proposal.

Speaker:  Madame Chair, I call the question.  
Chair: Moved and seconded.

Speaker: Point of information. Can we have clarification on the process of what is happening please?
Chair: We had a motion to reconsider the amendment to the original proposal which struck 15 and inserted 21, which was reconsidered.  Vote to Move the previous question.
Results: Yes – 72.4% No – 27.6%  Move the Previous Question Passed

Chair:  Move to vote on Proposal as originally presented which requires a 2/3rds majority vote.
Results: Yes – 51.7%; No – 48.3%  Proposal Failed

[Joshua Katz]

1 hour ago, Guest A Brown said:

hings moved so fast that I don't think people realized what was going on, and I doubt very many in attendance knew that it wasn't handled correctly.

Oh, I don't doubt that. I'm just responding to your apparent implication that only someone who disliked the outcome would object.