Secret Ballots in Executive Session

[Guest Scarlet Miller]

We have traditionally held executive session within our meetings and in executive session we vote via secret ballot. If we go into executive session twice at different times in the meeting do we need two physical secret ballots or should board members get one and hold it throughout the meeting until all voting is done? 

[Josh Martin]

On 9/13/2023 at 8:11 PM, Guest Scarlet Miller said:

We have traditionally held executive session within our meetings and in executive session we vote via secret ballot. If we go into executive session twice at different times in the meeting do we need two physical secret ballots or should board members get one and hold it throughout the meeting until all voting is done? 

Normally you would need one ballot for each vote that is conducted by ballot, and the ballots are distributed at the time the vote is taken. I feel like I'm missing something.

[Guest Scarlet Miller]

This is helpful, we have been listing multiple line items/votes on one ballot during executive session, however, now we are moving to two separate executive sessions in one meeting with other business in between (and likely much time will pass) so it sounds like we will need two ballots for each session. 

[puzzling]

Voting in an executive session is not prescribed to be by ballot. (but the meeting  may do so if they want) 

Not sure what you mean by "should boardmembers  get one and holdvl it throughout the meeting until all voting is done'?

I am not even sure how you want  reuse ballot papers. You do ballots by marking slips with something inedible/unremovable. If you want to be more environmentally friendly it maybe better to use smaller bits of paper. But maybe you mean something completely different 

 

Edited September 14, 2023 at 12:29 PM by puzzling

[Josh Martin]

On 9/13/2023 at 10:06 PM, Guest Scarlet Miller said:

This is helpful, we have been listing multiple line items/votes on one ballot during executive session, however, now we are moving to two separate executive sessions in one meeting with other business in between (and likely much time will pass) so it sounds like we will need two ballots for each session. 

Thank you for this additional information. Based upon these additional facts, I am inclined to think it will, in fact, be necessary to have at least two ballots, one for each session - to the extent, of course, that the assembly wishes to vote by ballot on these items.

I'm still not entirely clear on how this works. Do you have the items prearranged in advance and preprinted ballots are provided with specific items listed? Or are perhaps generic ballots printed with "Item 1" and "Item 2" and so forth, and used for what items may come up? (Or simply very large blank slips of paper?) The reason I ask is because, if specific items are listed, it may be that additional items come up which were not known of in advance. So if the assembly wishes to vote on ballots on those items, further ballots may be needed. That is why I said at least two ballots.

On 9/14/2023 at 3:17 AM, puzzling said:

Not sure what you mean by "should boardmembers  get one and holdvl it throughout the meeting until all voting is done'?

You cannot reuse ballot papers , maybe you mean something different 

My understanding is that a number of resolutions will be considered on a single ballot, in a similar manner to how multiple elections may be considered on a single ballot, in a manner such as this:

Resolution 1: Yes/No

Resolution 2: Yes/No

Etc.

While somewhat unusual, I have seen methods of voting like this, generally in large conventions.

Edited September 14, 2023 at 12:43 PM by Josh Martin

[Guest Scarlet Miller]

Yes, exactly as you stated, we have items prearranged on a small ballot ahead of time and then additional space to add in items below in case the need may arise. The question came up last month from a director as to whether or not it may be best practice to do ballots based on how the agenda is laid out with an executive session (voting happens on items presented at this time) at the beginning of the meeting and one also toward the end. 

[Gary Novosielski]

On 9/13/2023 at 9:11 PM, Guest Scarlet Miller said:

We have traditionally held executive session within our meetings and in executive session we vote via secret ballot. If we go into executive session twice at different times in the meeting do we need two physical secret ballots or should board members get one and hold it throughout the meeting until all voting is done? 

In the usual case, multiple ballot votes would use multiple ballots, but if there were some reason that this was felt to be cumbersome, I think the rule would be suspendible by a two-thirds vote. 

If it was to be the common way of doing things, a Special Rule of Order could accomplish this.

But there's nothing in RONR that requires, or even suggests, that votes taken in executive session must be by ballot.  In my experience that would be rare.

But if these ballots are being taken during two separate executive sessions, I don't think trying to use one ballot makes sense.  In theory, a motion could be made during the first executive session, and voted on by ballot, but the vote not completed.  What happens then if a second executive session is moved, but the motion fails?  What has become of the vote that was never completed?   In order to avoid potential chaos, I think it's necessary for the executive session to complete the votes on any questions put during that session before coming out.  Again, I'm not seeing an advantage to routinely using ballots for all such votes.

[Atul Kapur]

I agree with the director and Mr. Martin that it would be better to have separate ballot papers for each of the two executive session  portions. To be excruciatingly clear, each ballot should be completed and ballot papers submitted immediately after the related executive session concludes.

Edited September 14, 2023 at 04:21 PM by Atul Kapur

[Guest Scarlet Miller]

Thank you all so very much. This group is extremely helpful. Glad I found you!