Adopting and Amending a Standing Rule

[Tomm]

RONR states in 2:23 that a standing rule "can be adopted or changed upon the same conditions as any ordinary act of the society." which I assume means a simple majority vote at any time.

C.Alan Jennings, PRP book on Robert's Rules says a standing rule can be adopted with a majority, but the requirements to amend are a majority vote with notice, two-thirds vote without notice, or a majority of the entire membership.

Am I missing something in RONR where it too mentions the requirement of notice, or two-thirds without notice to amend a standing rule?

[Joshua Katz]

Any "ordinary act of the society" can be adopted by a majority vote, or changed by the vote Jennings mentions. So the text you cite does not suggest it takes only a majority to amend a standing rule.

[Tomm]

On 10/15/2024 at 8:31 PM, Joshua Katz said:

So the text you cite does not suggest it takes only a majority to amend a standing rule.

Where can I find the citation in RONR that states it requires that a standing rule must be amended by a majority with previous notice, or 2/3rd's without previous notice or a majority of the entire membership?

[Joshua Katz]

On 10/15/2024 at 8:27 PM, Tomm said:

RONR states in 2:23 that a standing rule "can be adopted or changed upon the same conditions as any ordinary act of the society." which I assume means a simple majority vote at any time.

 

 

[Tomm]

On 10/15/2024 at 8:37 PM, Tomm said:

So the text you cite does not suggest it takes only a majority to amend a standing rule.

But where does it suggest that there needs to be more than a majority vote to amend? Where does the requirement for previous notice or 2/3rd's come from?

2:22 clearly defines what it takes to adopt or amend aa special rule of order, while 2:23 only talks about ordinary acts of a society!

Edited October 16, 2024 at 04:03 AM by Tomm
addition

[Atul Kapur]

The way to amend a motion that was adopted and is still in effect (such as a standing rule or any other "ordinary act") is the motion Amend Something Previously Adopted. The vote to adopt ASPA is as Mr. Jennings states in his book. See §35, particularly 35:2(7).

[Josh Martin]

On 10/15/2024 at 10:27 PM, Tomm said:

RONR states in 2:23 that a standing rule "can be adopted or changed upon the same conditions as any ordinary act of the society." which I assume means a simple majority vote at any time.

It is correct that a standing rule is adopted by a "simple" majority vote.

A standing rule (or any other "ordinary act of the society" is, however, changed by means of any of the following:

• A majority vote, with previous notice
• A 2/3 vote
• A vote of a majority of the entire membership

On 10/15/2024 at 10:27 PM, Tomm said:

Am I missing something in RONR where it too mentions the requirement of notice, or two-thirds without notice to amend a standing rule?

Yes, you are apparently missing the entirety of Section 35.

As you note, RONR states in 2:23 that a standing rule "can be adopted or changed upon the same conditions as any ordinary act of the society."

You are certainly correct that the condition for adoption of an ordinary act of the society is a majority vote.

"As stated in 1:6, the basic requirement for approval of an action or choice by a deliberative assembly, except where a rule provides otherwise, is a majority vote. The word majority means “more than half”; and when the term majority vote is used without qualification—as in the case of the basic requirement—it means more than half of the votes cast by persons entitled to vote, excluding blanks or abstentions, at a regular or properly called meeting." RONR (12th ed.) 44:1

However, the conditions for rescinding or amending an ordinary act of the society is:

• A majority vote, with previous notice
• A 2/3 vote
• A vote of a majority of the entire membership

"The motions to Rescind and to Amend Something Previously Adopted: ...

7. In an assembly, except when applied to a constitution, bylaws, or special rules of order, require (a) a two-thirds vote, (b) a majority vote when notice of intent to make the motion, stating the complete substance of the proposed change, has been given at the previous meeting within a quarterly time interval or in the call of the present meeting, or (c) a vote of a majority of the entire membership—any one of which will suffice." RONR (12th ed.) 35:2(7)

On 10/15/2024 at 10:49 PM, Tomm said:

But where does it suggest that there needs to be more than a majority vote to amend? Where does the requirement for previous notice or 2/3rd's come from?

2:22 clearly defines what it takes to adopt or amend aa special rule of order, while 2:23 only talks about ordinary acts of a society!

What is required to rescind or amend ordinary acts of the society is discussed in Section 35, for the aptly named motion "Rescind; Amend Something Previously Adopted."

Edited October 16, 2024 at 03:00 PM by Josh Martin