Can you make a rule to ignore quorum

[rthib]

Somewhere a few years back, the following rule was slipped into the standard rules that almost everyone uses for their conventions locally.

It reads:

A Quorum shall exist once 25% of the authorized strength of the convention has been registered.

Once declared, there shall be no further questions as to the presence of a quorum.

These are convention rules. Bylaws, etc are silent on quorum.

Never been an issue, but doesn't quorum fall under those rules that can not be suspended.

Just to clear, it is the "There shall be no further questions as to the presence of a quorum" part.

[Guest Edgar]

It's not unheard of for a society's rules to say that once a quorum has been established, it's continuing presence is, in essence, moot. That, of course, is not RONR's rule (which says that a quorum must continue to be present throughout the meeting) but a society's rules supersede RONR where there's a conflict.

But I'm not sure what this has to do with suspending the rule that establishes the quorum (which, as you note, can't be done). What quorum rule is being ignored?

[jstackpo]

Do your bylaws, as opposed to this piece of a "Convention Standing Rule" (I presume that is what it is and it gets (re)adopted each convention), contain a statement of what your convention quorum is?

What does your group understand to be the meanings of "authorized strength of the convention" and "registered".

But in any event, the bylaw statement of a quorum cannot be "suspended". Se p. 21 for the RONR default for a convention quorum if your bylaws don't state it.

[Guest Edgar]

. . . it's continuing presence . . .

Arrggghhh!

[Guest CastingSpells]

Arrggghhh!

Arrggghhh!

Is this about the continuing presence of the apostrophe, or something else?

[Guest Edgar]

Is this about the continuing presence of the apostrophe, or something else?

It's that darn apostrophe.

RMFjKF

[rthib]

It's not unheard of for a society's rules to say that once a quorum has been established, it's continuing presence is, in essence, moot. That, of course, is not RONR's rule (which says that a quorum must continue to be present throughout the meeting) but a society's rules supersede RONR where there's a conflict.

But I'm not sure what this has to do with suspending the rule that establishes the quorum (which, as you note, can't be done). What quorum rule is being ignored?

True to first part, but a society could not pass a rule at the meeting that say nonmembers get to vote or that proxy will be allowed at this convention.

here are certain things that you don't get to override on the fly (assuming bylaw etc are silent)

I was going on memory of RONR p. 263 ll.29-

Rules protecting absentees

Which talks about rules requiring the presence of a quorum.

But since we are passing a rule for the convention stating what a quorum is, then in the very next rule stating that once it is reached even if everyone leaves, it still exists felt like it violated this.

But in rereading, I guess it would only apply if the second part was passed.

So the way I am reading, if we only passed Quorum rule only.

If someone tried to make the change to the rules after a member had left, it should not be allowed as violating p. 263

But if everyone is present, then there is no absent member to protect, so everything is ok.

[Josh Martin]

Somewhere a few years back, the following rule was slipped into the standard rules that almost everyone uses for their conventions locally.

It reads:

A Quorum shall exist once 25% of the authorized strength of the convention has been registered.

Once declared, there shall be no further questions as to the presence of a quorum.

These are convention rules. Bylaws, etc are silent on quorum.

Never been an issue, but doesn't quorum fall under those rules that can not be suspended.

Just to clear, it is the "There shall be no further questions as to the presence of a quorum" part.

It's correct that the rule requiring the presence of a quorum to conduct business may not be suspended, but it is in order for the assembly to adopt rules which supersede Robert's Rules of Order, which are called special rules of order. Convention standing rules can contain special rules of order. Since the Bylaws are silent on quorum, it seems to me the rule is entirely proper. Whether it is wise is another question entirely.

True to first part, but a society could not pass a rule at the meeting that say nonmembers get to vote or that proxy will be allowed at this convention.

here are certain things that you don't get to override on the fly (assuming bylaw etc are silent)

I was going on memory of RONR p. 263 ll.29-

Rules protecting absentees

Which talks about rules requiring the presence of a quorum.

You're confusing the motion to Suspend the Rules with the adoption of convention standing rules or special rules of order. Some objectives cannot be achieved by a suspension of the rules but can be achieved by the adoption of a convention standing rule or special rule of order. This rule is one of them, since the Bylaws are silent on the subject.

You are correct that you cannot adopt such a rule to permit non-members to vote or to permit proxy voting. Those objectives can only be achieved by an amendment to the Bylaws.

But since we are passing a rule for the convention stating what a quorum is, then in the very next rule stating that once it is reached even if everyone leaves, it still exists felt like it violated this.

But in rereading, I guess it would only apply if the second part was passed.

So the way I am reading, if we only passed Quorum rule only.

If someone tried to make the change to the rules after a member had left, it should not be allowed as violating p. 263

But if everyone is present, then there is no absent member to protect, so everything is ok.

The problem is that what you're reading on pg. 263 applies to the motion to Suspend the Rules. The assembly may adopt a convention standing rule to supersede the usual rules in RONR pertaining to the quorum, whether or not there are absentees.

If you don't care for this (and I don't blame you), it might be wise to put the quorum requirement in your Bylaws, so it can't be tinkered with so easily.