public meeting cancellation procedure

[pattsi]

I can not find the answers to the following questions in the RRO materials. So I need help finding the answers or if you can provide such.
 

1. If a meeting is recessed for a 10 minute break, by RRO is it necessary to have a roll call to establish what members are still in attendance to declare a quorum when the meeting resumes after the break? A roll call is done when the meeting is called to order originally.
 

2. If it is announced and agendas made public for a special meeting of a public elected body to start at "X" time on "Y" date followed by a committee of the whole (COW) meeting, according to the agenda to begin 30 minutes after the start time of the special meeting and on the same date, what action needs to be taken about the COW that never occurred because the special meeting ran over 4 hours? The COW meeting was never called to order. Does an anno uncement need to be made publicly that the COW meeting is cancelled? When does this announcement need to be made? Is a motion necessary to move the COW business to a date and time certain or can all of this be left open for a later public announcement? Can the chair just unilaterally make these determinations without approval of the elected body?
 

Thank you for any and all help.  Pattsi Petrie

[Richard Brown]

Pattsi,  since this is a public body it is almost certainly governed by your State's open-meetings laws. Those laws are sometimes called Sunshine laws. In addition, your council may have its own rules on the subject. Those laws and rules generally govern agenda procedures and would supersede whatever is in RONR.

[Kim Goldsworthy]

11 hours ago, pattsi said:

1. If a meeting is recessed for a 10 minute break,

by [Robert's Rules of Order]

is it necessary to have a roll call

to establish what members are still in attendance to declare a quorum when the meeting resumes after the break?

A roll call is done when the meeting is called to order originally.

No.

There is no text in the current edition of Robert's Rules of Order to imply that a formal roll call is to be re-invoked after every recess.

If you have a quorum, you are good to go, even if you do not invoke a roll call.

[Kim Goldsworthy]

11 hours ago, pattsi said:

2.A. If it is announced and agendas made public for a special meeting of a public elected body to start at "X" time on "Y" date followed by a committee of the whole (COW) meeting, according to the agenda to begin 30 minutes after the start time of the special meeting and on the same date,

what action needs to be taken about the COW that never occurred because the special meeting ran over 4 hours?

The COW meeting was never called to order.

2.B. Does an announcement need to be made publicly that the COW meeting is cancelled?

2.C. When does this announcement need to be made?

2.D. Is a motion necessary to move the COW business to a date and time certain or can all of this be left open for a later public announcement?

2.E. Can the chair just unilaterally make these determinations without approval of the elected body?

 

You say your meeting "ran over 4 hours". But you didn't say that it was adjourned, or otherwise extended.

***

Sunshine laws vary from state to state. But I would bet that all sunshine laws consider each meeting which has been finally adjourned to be over, and that the next gathering represents a "new" meeting, and thus demands a "new" notice.

If you had agenda items never reached, then, (you should verify this with your legal counsel), you will likely need to re-notice all business due to be entertained in your upcoming meeting. -- One (old) notice cannot cover two meetings. (Again, verify this with your legal counsel.)

[pattsi]

Thank you for the thoughtful input.

[pattsi]

On 1/11/2017 at 10:30 PM, Kim Goldsworthy said:

No.

There is no text in the current edition of Robert's Rules of Order to imply that a formal roll call is to be re-invoked after every recess.

If you have a quorum, you are good to go, even if you do not invoke a roll call.

O.K. I have a further question for clarification. It is my understanding when a public body goes into closed session, there is a roll call vote to this motion. When the public body returns to open session, another roll call is done to establish the meeting quorum and what members of the public body are still present. Why is that not the same procedure for the meeting being called back to order after a recess of any length by RRO.

The special meeting after 4 hours was adjourned. The COW agenda was folded into the next county board agenda with no procedural announcement.

[Kim Goldsworthy]

1 hour ago, pattsi said:

S1.) It is my understanding when a public body goes into closed session, there is a roll call vote to this motion.

S2.) When the public body returns to open session, another roll call is done to establish the meeting quorum and what members of the public body are still present.

S3.) Why is that not the same procedure for the meeting being called back to order after a recess of any length by RRO?

S1 is FALSE, per Robert's Rules of Order. -- There is no roll call necessary.

S2 is FALSE, per Robert's Rules of Order. -- There is no roll call necessary.

S3 is moot, as both S1 and S2 are NOT THE CASE under the plain application of Robert's Rules of Order.

***

Q. Where did you get all this "understanding" (i.e., mis-understanding) of the never-ending "roll call"?

[Richard Brown]

2 hours ago, pattsi said:

O.K. I have a further question for clarification. It is my understanding when a public body goes into closed session, there is a roll call vote to this motion. When the public body returns to open session, another roll call is done to establish the meeting quorum and what members of the public body are still present. Why is that not the same procedure for the meeting being called back to order after a recess of any length by RRO.

The special meeting after 4 hours was adjourned. The COW agenda was folded into the next county board agenda with no procedural announcement.

Patti, the executive session (closed session) rules for public bodies that you speak of, if they in fact exist,  are almost certainly state laws that are part of your state's open meetings laws and possibly your local jurisdiction's own rules. Those procedures are not required by RONR and are not part of RONR.

Edited January 23, 2017 at 09:17 PM by Richard Brown

[pattsi]

1. Richard Brown is accurate--Illinois has an Open Meetings Act, which trumps everything else. Next rules to follow are the county bylaws, and according to the bylaws the rest defaults to RRO. The OMA mandates a roll call to go into a closed session and then a roll call to go back to an open meeting.
2. Thank you again for all of the input.