Guest Aggie Posted April 20, 2020 at 07:12 PM Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 at 07:12 PM Thank you in advance! Last board meeting a motion was made and it failed to pass. No other motion was made pertaining to the item of discussion on the agenda. Can that motion be made again by the same or different board member? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Aggie Posted April 20, 2020 at 07:16 PM Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 at 07:16 PM I might also add that there will be new board members that would have a chance to vote if this motion were made again. Didn't know if that mattered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted April 20, 2020 at 07:26 PM Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 at 07:26 PM A failed motion may be made again by any member at any subsequent session, yes. See RONR (11th ed.), p. 336ff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aggie Posted April 21, 2020 at 05:55 AM Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 at 05:55 AM So the motion was not allowed to be made again at this meeting tonight. The problem had to do with choosing an auditor. Two bids came in. A motion was made at the last meeting for a certain auditor to hire. It was voted down 4-3. So the discussion came up at this meeting tonight (a month later) and it was said by a board member that they would like to make the same motion, since there were two new members and that no other action was taken after the vote down last meeting. The president said it wasn't allowed and that they couldn't make that motion. I know this is incorrect but they did it anyway, even after a point of order made. They asserted that they were correct. So then another board member made a motion to hire the other auditor. It was tied and the president had to break the tie. How do you remedy the fact that the president was wrong and that the motion on the floor should have been the one that was spoken about first? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Katz Posted April 21, 2020 at 07:11 AM Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 at 07:11 AM 1 hour ago, Guest Aggie said: he president said it wasn't allowed and that they couldn't make that motion. I know this is incorrect but they did it anyway, even after a point of order made. If an incorrect ruling is made on a point of order, a member should appeal the decision, which puts it in the hands of the assembly. The question is stated as sustaining the ruling of the chair, so yes means you agree with the chair, and no means you do not. A majority can overturn the chair's decision. 1 hour ago, Guest Aggie said: So then another board member made a motion to hire the other auditor. It was tied and the president had to break the tie. Well, he didn't have to. If the vote is tied, the motion fails. But he was allowed to, and sounds like he did. The chair can also vote when the vote would impact the outcome, even if it is not tied - for instance, the chair can vote to create a tie so that the motion fails. On a small board, the chair may vote anytime. But (I mention this only because I've seen this misunderstanding before) the chair does not get 2 votes. 1 hour ago, Guest Aggie said: ow do you remedy the fact that the president was wrong and that the motion on the floor should have been the one that was spoken about first? You don't now. Points of order (and appeals) need to be timely, which generally means made at the time the situation arises. In this case, you've already adopted a motion to hire another auditor. You could move to rescind that, which requires a 2/3 vote, or a majority vote with notice, or a majority of the entire membership voting in the affirmative. If the motion is rescinded, you can then move to hire the first auditor. Another action that could have been taken at the last meeting would be to move to amend by striking out the name of the auditor and creating a blank, which could then be filled. This is useful when, as here, there are multiple candidates for a job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted April 21, 2020 at 02:41 PM Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 at 02:41 PM 7 hours ago, Joshua Katz said: You could move to rescind that, which requires a 2/3 vote, or a majority vote with notice, or a majority of the entire membership voting in the affirmative. If the motion is rescinded, you can then move to hire the first auditor. I think we would need to know precisely what the wording of the motion was to say for sure, but I am not certain a motion to Rescind would be in order. A motion to Rescind cannot be applied to a motion which has already been carried out, and you can't "unhire" someone. The appropriate course of action might be a new main motion to fire the auditor. Of course, parliamentary technicalities aside, there may also be practical and legal complications involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Katz Posted April 21, 2020 at 03:26 PM Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 at 03:26 PM 44 minutes ago, Josh Martin said: I think we would need to know precisely what the wording of the motion was to say for sure, but I am not certain a motion to Rescind would be in order. A motion to Rescind cannot be applied to a motion which has already been carried out, and you can't "unhire" someone. The appropriate course of action might be a new main motion to fire the auditor. I suppose the facts matter, too. If no action has been taken to carry it out (no one has called the auditor) it seems clear to me it can be rescinded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted April 21, 2020 at 03:38 PM Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 at 03:38 PM Noting Mr. Martin's comments about practical and legal complications, RONR has no prohibition on rescinding a contract at all. I don't think it matters at all if the auditor has been notified or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted April 21, 2020 at 05:50 PM Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 at 05:50 PM (edited) 2 hours ago, Joshua Katz said: I suppose the facts matter, too. If no action has been taken to carry it out (no one has called the auditor) it seems clear to me it can be rescinded. Yes, that seems reasonable. 2 hours ago, George Mervosh said: Noting Mr. Martin's comments about practical and legal complications, RONR has no prohibition on rescinding a contract at all. I don't think it matters at all if the auditor has been notified or not. RONR has no prohibition on rescinding a motion in the nature of a contract, but it does have rules which prohibit rescinding a motion which has already been carried out. If a motion is adopted to "hire an auditor" and the auditor has, in fact, been hired, I don't see how it is possible to rescind this motion. The auditor can be fired, but he can't be "unhired." As I said, however, this depends on the particular wording of the motion that the assembly adopted, and as Mr. Katz correctly notes, also depends on what exactly has been done (if anything) to carry out the motion. RONR does note that the unexecuted part of the motion may be rescinded. So if the wording is more involved, it may well be possible to rescind the unexecuted part of the motion. For instance, perhaps the motion was "to hire an auditor to conduct an audit of the society's finances for the previous fiscal year," and while the auditor has been hired, the audit has not yet been conducted. I have no disagreement that the unexecuted part of the motion could be rescinded, as a parliamentary matter. Edited April 21, 2020 at 05:51 PM by Josh Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted April 21, 2020 at 06:04 PM Report Share Posted April 21, 2020 at 06:04 PM I agree we don't know the motion's exact wording, but I still think it's entirely possible to rescind an agreement in the nature of a contract, or a flat out contract that where the service(s) provided under the contract are ongoing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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