Absent President

[Lanelle]

Because of not being able to find work in his home state, our president has had to go to an adjoining state to work. He is sometimes there for months before coming home. Understanding he has to take care of his family, the executive board decided to contact him to see if he is still going to be able to commit to his duties as president. Due to the urgency and the fact texting is the quickest way to contact him (a letter may take weeks before he gets it), we dediced to send him a text.

However, being the parlimentarian and secretary, my question is this: Should we also send him a letter as well, so we will have a record in the minutes book that he was contacted? This is the first time we have experienced this situation so there is nothing in our bylaws that covers the subject of a text message vs a letter.

Thanks

Lanele

[Mr. J!]

Because of not being able to find work in his home state, our president has had to go to an adjoining state to work. He is sometimes there for months before coming home. Understanding he has to take care of his family, the executive board decided to contact him to see if he is still going to be able to commit to his duties as president. Due to the urgency and the fact texting is the quickest way to contact him (a letter may take weeks before he gets it), we dediced to send him a text.

However, being the parlimentarian and secretary, my question is this: Should we also send him a letter as well, so we will have a record in the minutes book that he was contacted? This is the first time we have experienced this situation so there is nothing in our bylaws that covers the subject of a text message vs a letter.

Thanks

Lanele

Are you asking if he can submit a resignation by text message?

[Chris Harrison]

Because of not being able to find work in his home state, our president has had to go to an adjoining state to work. He is sometimes there for months before coming home. Understanding he has to take care of his family, the executive board decided to contact him to see if he is still going to be able to commit to his duties as president. Due to the urgency and the fact texting is the quickest way to contact him (a letter may take weeks before he gets it), we dediced to send him a text.

However, being the parlimentarian and secretary, my question is this: Should we also send him a letter as well, so we will have a record in the minutes book that he was contacted? This is the first time we have experienced this situation so there is nothing in our bylaws that covers the subject of a text message vs a letter.

Thanks

Lanele

Absent some provision in the bylaws I don't see why a resignation couldn't be submitted by text message as long as the intent to resign is apparent. However, I could see how a message might go:

VP-R U going 2 resign?

President-Yes. LOL

[E A Lemoine]

Your question is not parliamentary, as you can do whatever you want outside of a meeting to communicate with the president.

I agree that is the intent is clear, you can act on that information. But I would also make sure you have him send a letter (or even e-mail) for your official records that he has no intent on continuing his duties. Text messages are hard to "download" and print, unless your phone has those capabilities.

[Kim Goldsworthy]

Should we also send him a letter as well, so we will have a record in the minutes book that he was contacted?

In general, you don't put letters in minutes.

You don't put correspondence of any kind in minutes.

Minutes are supposed to hold only gavel-to-gavel data, e.g., motions; voting totals; whatever is adopted, whatever is rejected.

So, if you wish to mail a letter for the sake of one's minutes, then I don't see any proper relationship between the two concepts. -- Where is the motion? Where is the vote? What were you going to put into the minutes?

[Rev Ed]

Technically the Vice President (or Senior Vice President) will have the authority to perform the President's duties and responsibilities when the President is absent. As such there is no real reason why the organization must contact the President about this. Also, what do the By-laws state about the election, appointment, and removal of an Officer? For example, some organizations will have a by-law stating that if a Director or Officer does not attend a specific number of meetings within a year, and cannot produce satisfactory explanation for missing those meetings, the Board (or the general membership) may declare that the Director/Officer has abandoned his/her position.

I would suggest that the organization write the President to ask what his/her plans are for the future. Perhaps a hint should be made that if he/she is unable to continue as PResident in an appropriate manner that a resignation should be offered. If not, the President could be removed as shown in Chapter XX of RONR, or in your organization's By-laws, if required.

Then again, how long will you have to wait until the next election? It may just be easier to allow the Vice President to handle the President's duty and hope someone else is elected President when the Presdent's term expires.

[hmtcastle]

Technically the Vice President (or Senior Vice President) will have the authority to perform the President's duties and responsibilities when the President is absent.

In RONR-Land, that only refers to being absent from meetings, and only to the president's parliamentary, not administrative, authority. If an organization wants the vice-president to be able to act as president outside of the context of a meeting, it will have to establish that authority in the bylaws. Among other things, it will have to define "absent". Out of town for a day? A week? A month? Out of State? Out of Country? In the hospital?

Absence from a meeting is clearly defined and easily determined. Any other form of absence is not.

[Lanelle]

No, I am asking if in addition to sending him a text message as to whether he thinks he can continue his duties as president, should be also send him a letter by mail so we will have on record that he was notified and given the opportunity to resign.

Lanelle

[Lanelle]

July begins the second year of his term. He has missed quite a few regular meetings, failed to call meeting when there is business to vote on and other duties on campus that is required of the president. He does not respond to email which must go through his cell phone except for certain people.

As secretary, I have requested chairs who send out messages for votes by email, to please print them so we can have the votes on record, but so far have been ignored, so I am not sure if I can get them to print his message if he does decided to resign. I just think we need something on record (not in the minutes) to show that he was indeed contacted in case he says he did not get the text message.

[Dan Honemann]

July begins the second year of his term. He has missed quite a few regular meetings, failed to call meeting when there is business to vote on and other duties on campus that is required of the president. He does not respond to email which must go through his cell phone except for certain people.

As secretary, I have requested chairs who send out messages for votes by email, to please print them so we can have the votes on record, but so far have been ignored, so I am not sure if I can get them to print his message if he does decided to resign. I just think we need something on record (not in the minutes) to show that he was indeed contacted in case he says he did not get the text message.

OK, but none of this has anything at all to do with parliamentary procedure in deliberative assemblies (which is what this forum is all about).

[Kim Goldsworthy]

I am asking if in addition to sending him a text message as to whether he thinks he can continue his duties as president, should be also send him a letter by mail so we will have on record that he was notified and given the opportunity to resign.

"Should"?

Robert's Rules has no answer.

Whether you should mail the president a letter, or telephone the president, or e-mail the president, or all three, is up to you, collectively.

Robert's Rules of Order contains NO SUCH RULE like "Thou shalt mail your president a letter to ask the president to resign."

Resignations are VOLUNTARY. It is up to the president to resign. It isn't up to the organization to ASK a president to resign. - That is a waste of time, since resignation are voluntary. "Asking" gets you nowhere. The president must still initiate the resignation by the president's own hand, or own mouth.

So no parliamentary rule will tell you, yes/no, to send a letter in lieu of a phone call. Or vice versa.

Send the letter if you'd like - no rule in RONR 10th ed. will stop you. What happens OUTSIDE of a meeting (like writing letters) isn't controlled by a parliamentary rule. It's a free country. People are free to write letters to each other.

[Rev Ed]

In RONR-Land, that only refers to being absent from meetings, and only to the president's parliamentary, not administrative, authority. If an organization wants the vice-president to be able to act as president outside of the context of a meeting, it will have to establish that authority in the bylaws. Among other things, it will have to define "absent". Out of town for a day? A week? A month? Out of State? Out of Country? In the hospital?

Absence from a meeting is clearly defined and easily determined. Any other form of absence is not.

Concurred. However, most (if not all) organizations that I know of allow the Vice President to assume the President's administrative (i.e. non-meeting related) duties. Then again, outside a meeting, the President's duties have to be authorized in either the By-laws or by authority of the Board. The time period may very, but if the President will be unavailable for some time, then the V.P. can simply handle any issues. For short term absences, it would depend on the situation. If a quick decision is required, then the V.P. should take any actions that the President would be allowed to perform - otherwise the President can handle the issue upon his/her return.

[Josh Martin]

Concurred. However, most (if not all) organizations that I know of allow the Vice President to assume the President's administrative (i.e. non-meeting related) duties.

The Vice President can only assume the administrative authority of the President in the President's absence if the Bylaws provide for this.

Then again, outside a meeting, the President's duties have to be authorized in either the By-laws or by authority of the Board.

The President only has administrative authority outside of a meeting as authorized by the Bylaws. (RONR, 10th ed., pg. 440, lines 21-25) The board does not have the authority to grant administrative authority to the President unless such authority is granted by the Bylaws. (RONR, 10th ed., pg. 467, line 32 - pg. 468, line 3)