Running for multiple offices

[Guest Bobby]

Is there anything that procludes or affirms wether or not an individual can run for two offices in a single election. For example, if for some reason an association elects a vice president before a president, can an individual run for VP and then accept a nomination for president? Perhaps they resign the VP spot if he or she wins the presidential election causing a revote for the VO position?

[Weldon Merritt]

There is no prohibition in RONR on runiing for mutiple offices. But the election should be conducted in the order in which the officers are listed in the byalws (which usually is president first).

[Guest bobby]

There is no prohibition in RONR on runiing for mutiple offices. But the election should be conducted in the order in which the officers are listed in the byalws (which usually is president first).

When offcies that are elected do not take effect for a month, can I then presume that one is not holding multiple offices until that time? Point is that it gives freedom to not "pass" on an office that he or she feels he or she may win and than effectively take a chance on a future office that is perhaps more appealing. The example I provided is president and vice president. Let's say the two offices are listed for this example as VP then president in the bylaws. How do you handle it when an individual has won two elections and bylaws will ultimately prevent them as holding both. Does that mean you "revote" during that same election for the position that the bylaws state will ultimately have to be vacated?

[hmtcastle]

Does that mean you "revote" during that same election for the position that the bylaws state will ultimately have to be vacated?

Yes. If the person who was elected declines the office, you have an incomplete election and must vote again until you elect someone who is willing and able to serve.

By the way, you don't necessarily have to vote for one office at a time (though that may be more convenient). You can put all the offices on the same ballot (just the way it's done on Election Day).

[Josh Martin]

Point is that it gives freedom to not "pass" on an office that he or she feels he or she may win and than effectively take a chance on a future office that is perhaps more appealing.

Which is why it's even more sensible to elect the President first. The candidates can then take the risk for President and then have VP as the fallback position.

Let's say the two offices are listed for this example as VP then president in the bylaws.

Then the Bylaws should be amended. The President should always be listed before the Vice President in the Bylaws. (RONR, 10th ed., pg. 555, lines 21-24)

[Kim Goldsworthy]

... can run for two offices in a single election.

The sound bite answer is, "There are no qualifications for office under RONR."

A single person can be : President, Vice President, Secretary, Treasurer, Sergeant-At-Arms, Chief Cook And Bottle Washer, Grand Poo-Bah, and Dog Catcher.

Granted, this overload is not recommended. It is nicer to spread the work.

*****

But when that bus load of officers, on its way to Mexico for a junket, goes flying off the cliff into the Gulf of California, killing all on board, then the remaining officer(s) of the organization may have to wear two hats, three hats, four hats, ..., N hats.

And no rule is violated, as far as The Book is concerned. - Dual roles are okay. - Sometimes necessary!

*****

[alanh49]

The sound bite answer is, "There are no qualifications for office under RONR."

A single person can be : President, Vice President, Secretary, Treasurer, Sergeant-At-Arms, Chief Cook And Bottle Washer, Grand Poo-Bah, and Dog Catcher.

I disagree I do not believe that the same person can be both president and vice president at the same time. Now you can run for both at the same time. You just can't be both at the same time.

[David A Foulkes]

You just can't be both at the same time.

And the RONR page citation for this is.................?

[alanh49]

And the RONR page citation for this is.................?

Will common sense do? you can't be your own successor or preside in your own absence.

[Kim Goldsworthy]

Will common sense do?

No, it won't.

There are no qualifications for office - any office - in RONR.

• You don't have to read and write, to be elected as a Secretary.

• You don't have to add and subtract, to be elected as a Treassurer.

• You don't have to know parliamentary procedure, to be elected as Chairman.

You can't be your own successor or preside in your own absence.

You are assuming too much.

You assume that the primary purpose of a vice president is to act as a presiding officer when the president is absent.

But for many organizations, that is not the purpose of their vice president.

For these organizations, there are specific DUTIES linked to each office of their various vice presidents (1st VP, 2nd VP, 3rd VP, etc.).

When someone is recruited to serve in capacity of (say) 3rd VP, it is because the bylaws spell out specific duties for that position. The Refreshments Chair, the Program Chair, the Finance Chair, etc., are linked to specific vice presidential offices. So if someone has an interest in being Program Chair, that certain someone will have to run for 3rd VP if he or she wishes to chair that specific committee.

RONR allows for a chair pro tem to be selected when the P and VP are not present.

So the issue of "serving in the absence of the president" is pretty tiny, since the assembly has zero restrictions on its freedom to choose a chair pro tem.

Even a nonmember can be chair pro tem.

Even a convicted felon.

Even a suspended member or an expelled member.

RONR has no qualifications for office, not even for chair pro tem.

So, because RONR has no restrictions on the number of "hats" a single individual may wear, then RONR has no restriction on a single person serving as president and vice president, simultaneously.

[Trina]

....

You assume that the primary purpose of a vice president is to act as a presiding officer when the president is absent.

But for many organizations, that is not the purpose of their vice president.

For these organizations, there are specific DUTIES linked to each office of their various vice presidents (1st VP, 2nd VP, 3rd VP, etc.)

.....

So, because RONR has no restrictions on the number of "hats" a single individual may wear, then RONR has no restriction on a single person serving as president and vice president, simultaneously.

I've seen this in practice in one organization I belong to -- president resigned for health reasons, VP took over as president, but remained as VP also (because no one else was willing to do the VP job). The VP has lots of non-parliamentary duties in this organization, and is critical to the proper functioning of the organization. Our overloaded, but competent, President cum VP served in both positions for the better part of a year, and did a good job to boot. Presiding at meetings was the least part of her worries; if she was absent, someone else would preside pro tem.

[Josh Martin]

I disagree I do not believe that the same person can be both president and vice president at the same time.

No rule in RONR would prevent it. As you correctly note, there's not much point in such an arrangement if the duties of the VP are only those provided under RONR. However, as Mr. Goldsworthy notes, in many organizations the VP has significant administrative duties.