question about straw polls

[Trina]

I recently came across the language about straw polls again -- i.e. that a motion to take such a poll is meaningless and dilatory, and therefore not in order.

However, if the same assembly goes through the additional steps of going into a committee of the whole (or quasi committee of the whole), discussing and voting on the same straw poll question, and then coming out of the committee of the whole (rising and reporting), that's OK.

So, if a member moves to take a straw poll vote, should the chair recommend this other procedure, in order to accomplish exactly what the member wanted to do in the first place, but doing it via a series of steps blessed by RONR?

Any thoughts on why it is important to take the extra steps? Is it just so the members are absolutely clear on the fact that they are making a recommendation rather than making a binding decision?

[g40]

If the "assembly" is fewer than about a dozen members, then informal discussion is permitted and may accomplish the same result as a "staw poll".

[Rob Elsman]

I recently came across the language about straw polls again -- i.e. that a motion to take such a poll is meaningless and dilatory, and therefore not in order.

However, if the same assembly goes through the additional steps of going into a committee of the whole (or quasi committee of the whole), discussing and voting on the same straw poll question, and then coming out of the committee of the whole (rising and reporting), that's OK.

So, if a member moves to take a straw poll vote, should the chair recommend this other procedure, in order to accomplish exactly what the member wanted to do in the first place, but doing it via a series of steps blessed by RONR?

Any thoughts on why it is important to take the extra steps? Is it just so the members are absolutely clear on the fact that they are making a recommendation rather than making a binding decision?

A vote in committee of the whole (or quasi committee of the whole) on a motion to adopt a report is not a straw vote. Neither is such a vote in an ordinary committee a straw vote.

[Trina]

A vote in committee of the whole (or quasi committee of the whole) on a motion to adopt a report is not a straw vote. Neither is such a vote in an ordinary committee a straw vote.

Yes, I realize the committee is taking an actual vote to do something (adopt a report). However, if a member wants to get a sense of the opinion of the assembly, and makes a motion to take a straw poll, should the chair recommend this other sequence of steps? In most assemblies (except perhaps those very sophisticated about RONR, where such an improper motion wouldn't be made in the first place) the motion maker would, in the end, get the result he/she was looking for when requesting a 'straw poll'.

Or should the chair just rule the motion out of order?

As for the second question I asked in the original post, I guess I'm having trouble with the 'duck' test -- if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, etc.

[Rob Elsman]

Yes, I realize the committee is taking an actual vote to do something (adopt a report). However, if a member wants to get a sense of the opinion of the assembly, and makes a motion to take a straw poll, should the chair recommend this other sequence of steps? In most assemblies (except perhaps those very sophisticated about RONR, where such an improper motion wouldn't be made in the first place) the motion maker would, in the end, get the result he/she was looking for when requesting a 'straw poll'.

Or should the chair just rule the motion out of order?

As for the second question I asked in the original post, I guess I'm having trouble with the 'duck' test -- if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, etc.

If I'm in the chair, I'll rule the request for a "straw poll" out of order and, otherwise, keep my mouth shut. While it is true that the chair has a duty to help a member make the proper motion that conforms to his intent, I have no reason to think that a member who wants to have a "straw poll" really intends to refer the question to a committee.