Guest Sheila Posted July 10, 2012 at 06:57 PM Report Share Posted July 10, 2012 at 06:57 PM We are a tenant association for elderly members of a housing community. Rules have been fast and loose for years and the bylaws gone unreviewed for forever.The current bylaws state they "shall be reviewed every two years by a temporary committee, which shall recommend to the Executive Board any changes that need to be made."I (pres.) and the other officers assumed this means that we would have the final input on the draft before it was taken to the general membership. The chair of the temporary committee insists that they have total control over the revision.It will all go before the membership and debated item by item, but this is not a population that you can easily work with, and it will probably not be done again for a long time. I'm serving for just two years in order to bring some sanity to the association and a better working relationship with the housing authority in order to preserve the rights of the tenants.What is the best way to go about showing the committee that the board (which has the best knowledge of the faults of the current bylaws from working with them) has the right to input.Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Harrison Posted July 10, 2012 at 07:31 PM Report Share Posted July 10, 2012 at 07:31 PM Well, the bylaws do say "shall recommend to the Executive Board" which seems to imply that the Board should at least see the amendments before they go to the General Membership. Whether "shall recommend to the Executive Board" means that the Committee can just say "we recommend these amendments" and take them to the General Membership or if the Board has any control over what amendments go before the General Membership is for the body which has the power to amend the bylaws (which appears to be the General Membership) to determine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Wynn Posted July 10, 2012 at 09:23 PM Report Share Posted July 10, 2012 at 09:23 PM We are a tenant association for elderly members of a housing community. Rules have been fast and loose for years and the bylaws gone unreviewed for forever.The current bylaws state they "shall be reviewed every two years by a temporary committee, which shall recommend to the Executive Board any changes that need to be made."I (pres.) and the other officers assumed this means that we would have the final input on the draft before it was taken to the general membership. The chair of the temporary committee insists that they have total control over the revision.It will all go before the membership and debated item by item, but this is not a population that you can easily work with, and it will probably not be done again for a long time. I'm serving for just two years in order to bring some sanity to the association and a better working relationship with the housing authority in order to preserve the rights of the tenants.What is the best way to go about showing the committee that the board (which has the best knowledge of the faults of the current bylaws from working with them) has the right to input.Thanks.The real question is how the bylaws are amended. Check the bylaws for an article on amendment, usually located near the end of the document. While it seems that the committee recommends, you're actually asking about the amendment process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Edgar Posted July 10, 2012 at 09:31 PM Report Share Posted July 10, 2012 at 09:31 PM . . . this is not a population that you can easily work with . . .That's democracy for ya.Or gerontocracy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Wynn Posted July 10, 2012 at 10:34 PM Report Share Posted July 10, 2012 at 10:34 PM Or gerontocracy?Oh, you mean like the Honemann Rules of Order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. J. Posted July 11, 2012 at 12:51 AM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 12:51 AM Oh, you mean like the Honemann Rules of Order. God Dan is going to get you for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Wynn Posted July 11, 2012 at 01:12 AM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 01:12 AM God Dan is going to get you for that. No, I put a smiley face. Don't under estimate the power of little cartoon figures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Ed Posted July 11, 2012 at 01:34 AM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 01:34 AM I'd say that it is up to the Board to take the proposed amendments to the membership. The Committee's duty states that it recommends changes to the Board. Thus the Board would be allowed to offer their opinion on the proposed changes. I'd recommend an amendment to clarify the issue. What do the By-laws states about the amendments to the By-laws other then the Committee? The Board could potentially suggest other amendments - and if they are members of the organization could also speak for or against the recommended changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sheila Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:24 AM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:24 AM The real question is how the bylaws are amended. Check the bylaws for an article on amendment, usually located near the end of the document.While it seems that the committee recommends, you're actually asking about the amendment process."Amendments may be made by a majority vote of members at a duly constituted meeting . . ." That's not what this is.The review is of the entire thing and the new document replaces the old in its entirety, which I believe is what RR states is the proper way of doing it for a review. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:33 AM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:33 AM I'd say that it is up to the Board to take the proposed amendments to the membership. The Committee's duty states that it recommends changes to the Board. Thus the Board would be allowed to offer their opinion on the proposed changes. I'd recommend an amendment to clarify the issue.What do the By-laws states about the amendments to the By-laws other then the Committee? The Board could potentially suggest other amendments - and if they are members of the organization could also speak for or against the recommended changes.I agree with your suggestion to add an amendment to clarify the issue. I'm thinking of making a motion to do so at the next regular meeting, next month if the chair of the temporary review committee states absolutely that the board has no say in the final draft. The chair has called a general meeting this week to get input from the tenants. I'll ask her outright about this during that meeting.At the very least, I and other board members can propose amendments after the new bylaws have been adopted.I carefully worded the motion to create this committee to include the actual wording of the current bylaws that states that the committee would "recommend" changes to the board.Thanks for your thoughtful reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trina Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:35 AM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:35 AM ...The current bylaws state they "shall be reviewed every two years by a temporary committee, which shall recommend to the Executive Board any changes that need to be made."I (pres.) and the other officers assumed this means that we would have the final input on the draft before it was taken to the general membership. The chair of the temporary committee insists that they have total control over the revision....What is the best way to go about showing the committee that the board (which has the best knowledge of the faults of the current bylaws from working with them) has the right to input.Thanks."Amendments may be made by a majority vote of members at a duly constituted meeting . . ." That's not what this is.The review is of the entire thing and the new document replaces the old in its entirety, which I believe is what RR states is the proper way of doing it for a review.What you describe here is properly called a revision (not a review).How was the 'temporary committee' mentioned in the bylaws established, and who appointed the committee members? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Wynn Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:39 AM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:39 AM "Amendments may be made by a majority vote of members at a duly constituted meeting . . ." That's not what this is.The review is of the entire thing and the new document replaces the old in its entirety, which I believe is what RR states is the proper way of doing it for a review.That is what this is. A revision is an amendment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sheila Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:39 AM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 11:39 AM What you describe here is properly called a revision (not a review).How was the 'temporary committee' mentioned in the bylaws established, and who appointed the committee members?It's called a review in the current bylaws. The chair of the "temporary committee" was appointed by motion during a regular meeting, and she chose the other two members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trina Posted July 11, 2012 at 12:04 PM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 12:04 PM It's called a review in the current bylaws. The chair of the "temporary committee" was appointed by motion during a regular meeting, and she chose the other two members.A regular meeting of what? Board? General membership? Did the motion give the committee specific instructions?The bylaws snippet you quoted says nothing about a 'revision' (in the technical sense). The committee is to recommend 'changes that need to be made.' The word 'changes' could cover everything from correcting typos, to a wholesale revision of the bylaws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sheila Posted July 11, 2012 at 12:56 PM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 12:56 PM A regular meeting of what? Board? General membership? Did the motion give the committee specific instructions?The bylaws snippet you quoted says nothing about a 'revision' (in the technical sense). The committee is to recommend 'changes that need to be made.' The word 'changes' could cover everything from correcting typos, to a wholesale revision of the bylaws.A regular meeting of the general membership. No instructions. As I said, this is the way it is worded now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trina Posted July 11, 2012 at 04:12 PM Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 at 04:12 PM ...I carefully worded the motion to create this committee to include the actual wording of the current bylaws that states that the committee would "recommend" changes to the board....A regular meeting of the general membership. No instructions. As I said, this is the way it is worded now.Which is it? Were there "no instructions" at all? Instructions to review the bylaws and "recommend changes to the board" as you said in your earlier post?Since the committee was established by the general membership, only the general membership can rein in the committee if the committee isn't doing what it was instructed to do. The board doesn't have this authority.If the motion establishing the committee clearly says that the committee should report to the board, then it is certainly appropriate to point this wording out to the members of the committee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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