Is a Motion required to vote a new member in?

[Guest Babar Khan]

We hold a meeting of 20-25 people (Toasmasters club) and are soon going to induct a new member.

Usually in our club a motion is raised and the candidate to be voted on is escorted outside before discussion can take place on him and then he is only called inside once the voting has finished.

Is a motion necessary to be raised to vote in a new member?

What would be the correct procedure?

And once the motion is stated by the chair , does the chair have to tell someone to escort the candidate outside ? and then only can he open the floor on discussion abpout the motion raised?

Would really appreciate clarification on this procedure.

Thanks

BK

[Chris Harrison]

What do the bylaws say regarding how someone becomes a member? In some organizations someone becomes a member when they pay their dues, some have a formal voting procedure, and some become members just by showing up and saying they are interested. What does yours say?

[Trina]

...

Usually in our club a motion is raised and the candidate to be voted on is escorted outside before discussion can take place on him and then he is only called inside once the voting has finished.

Is a motion necessary to be raised to vote in a new member?

What would be the correct procedure?

And once the motion is stated by the chair , does the chair have to tell someone to escort the candidate outside ? and then only can he open the floor on discussion abpout the motion raised?

...

RONR has no prescribed method for making someone a member -- that is left up to the rules of the organization.

You describe a customary procedure in your club -- all the details seem to be pretty much in place. Are you concerned that there is something wrong with the procedure that is usually followed? As Chris H. suggests, check the bylaws (of your local club; also perhaps the rules of the larger organization, which may have something to say about how members are to be inducted).

[sMargaret]

In my Toastmasters club, you become a member by giving the treasurer a cheque for the annual fee. Cheque doesn't even need to clear before you're presented with your personalized name tag.

We don't have any pre-requisites for membership, though, and some other clubs may do (from a particular business, or a particular level of speaking).

So whatever rules you have are the rules as set out in YOUR bylaws. If your bylaws don't give any information on this, you may wish to formalize your procedure in your bylaws. Or you may wish to completely toss out your customary procedure, on the grounds that you always accept new members - but at least discuss it as a club (making sure that only actual members vote).

[Guest Babar Khan]

Thanks for the quick response.

I have gone through my club by laws and there doesnt seem to be a mention of a motion that is to be raised to vote in a new member.

My club is just doing this as a customary practice and I believe its unecessary .

Therefore I think that the chair/president , instead of waiting for a motion to be raised by someone from the general assembly, can just ask the VP Membership to make an announcement for the new member. The VP membership does exactly that and then asks the candidate to be escorted outside and then discusses about the candidate with the general assembly and calls for a vote.Once the vote is passed, the candidate is called back and possible induction ceremony may begin.

This way should be easy to get a new member voted and inducted without any need for a motion to be raised and complicating the matter.

What do you all think? Or for any voting/business such as this to be carried, a motion needs to be raised ?

[Guest Edgar]

. . . for any voting/business such as this to be carried, a motion needs to be raised ?

Yes, what you're voting on is a motion. It's the motion to accept John Doe as a member. What else would you be voting on? And what's more complicated about it? Do you want to eliminate debate on the motion?

[Trina]

Thanks for the quick response.

I have gone through my club by laws and there doesnt seem to be a mention of a motion that is to be raised to vote in a new member.

Is there any mention of voting on the potential new member (even if the word 'motion' is nowhere in evidence)? Or is your entire approval procedure a matter of custom, rather than being prescribed by the bylaws?

My club is just doing this as a customary practice and I believe its unecessary .

Therefore I think that the chair/president , instead of waiting for a motion to be raised by someone from the general assembly, can just ask the VP Membership to make an announcement for the new member. The VP membership does exactly that and then asks the candidate to be escorted outside and then discusses about the candidate with the general assembly and calls for a vote.Once the vote is passed, the candidate is called back and possible induction ceremony may begin.

This way should be easy to get a new member voted and inducted without any need for a motion to be raised and complicating the matter.

What do you all think? Or for any voting/business such as this to be carried, a motion needs to be raised ?

What do you think you're voting on if not a motion? And why is the presentation of the motion viewed as a complication? Now, this might be a circumstance where the chair could assume the motion is before the assembly, rather than waiting for a member to pop up and state, "I move that John Doe be accepted as a member." Is that what you mean about streamlining the process? All in all though, I'm not really seeing how making a motion is adding much time and complexity to the procedure...

[Guest Babar Khan]

The Toasmaster Guidelines and my Club By laws state that its a must for a new member to be voted .

'What do you think you're voting on if not a motion? And why is the presentation of the motion viewed as a complication?'

So for a vote to take place , a motion always has to be raised?

In my club's scenario If a motion is raised , matter becomes complex when the chair anounces that 'there is a motion on the floor to accept John Doe as a member ,raised and seconded by so and so respectively' and immediately after that asks the Sergeant @ arms to escort the candidate outside. Only once the candidate is outside can the chair open the motion for debate.

The part about asking the candidate to go utside does not fit in well with the motion. Because once the motion is raised there should be an immediate debate ,discussion and then a call for vote.

Now if its done like that then its not nice for a candidate to be seated inside while his acceptance is debated and discussed infront of him/her.

I maybe misinformed on the above.

If its considered normal parliamentary procedure to raise a motion for acceptance of a new member and the chair without debating the motion can ask the member to be escorted out , then I see no complex issues for a motion to be raised and this procedure to be followed.

Also I was reading about other clubs and how the VP Education/Membership just makes the announcement ,asks the candidate to be escorted outside and then the general assembly discuss about the candidate and call for a vote. Would that be wrong parliamentary procedure?

[Guest Edgar]

The part about asking the candidate to go outside does not fit in well with the motion. Because once the motion is raised there should be an immediate debate ,discussion and then a call for vote.

Also I was reading about other clubs and how the VP Education/Membership just makes the announcement ,asks the candidate to be escorted outside and then the general assembly discuss about the candidate and call for a vote. Would that be wrong parliamentary procedure?

Frankly, I can't see any difference between the motion and the announcement so phrase the announcement as a motion and you're good to go.

[Tim Wynn]

The Toasmaster Guidelines and my Club By laws state that its a must for a new member to be voted .

'What do you think you're voting on if not a motion? And why is the presentation of the motion viewed as a complication?'

So for a vote to take place , a motion always has to be raised?

In my club's scenario If a motion is raised , matter becomes complex when the chair anounces that 'there is a motion on the floor to accept John Doe as a member ,raised and seconded by so and so respectively' and immediately after that asks the Sergeant @ arms to escort the candidate outside. Only once the candidate is outside can the chair open the motion for debate.

The part about asking the candidate to go utside does not fit in well with the motion. Because once the motion is raised there should be an immediate debate ,discussion and then a call for vote.

Now if its done like that then its not nice for a candidate to be seated inside while his acceptance is debated and discussed infront of him/her.

I maybe misinformed on the above.

If its considered normal parliamentary procedure to raise a motion for acceptance of a new member and the chair without debating the motion can ask the member to be escorted out , then I see no complex issues for a motion to be raised and this procedure to be followed.

Also I was reading about other clubs and how the VP Education/Membership just makes the announcement ,asks the candidate to be escorted outside and then the general assembly discuss about the candidate and call for a vote. Would that be wrong parliamentary procedure?

If your rules require the candidate to be removed from the meeting before the motion on his acceptance to membership is considered, it is proper for the chair to ensure that this happens.

If your rules do not require this, any member can make a motion that the candidate be excused during the consideration of his acceptance to membership. This is a question of privilege and can be made at any time; it requires a majority vote.

[David A Foulkes]

Until this candidate is voted in as a new member, he is a non-member, and as such has no rights at the meeting including the right of attendance.

Rather than have a motion and vote, the chair could seek unanimous consent (likely to work only for someone favored by all) by asking "If there's no objection, we will accept John Doe as a member....." (pause)... and if no one objects, welcome John back to the room. If there's an objection, a motion and vote are the way to proceed.

I'd suggest you formalize the procedure (with all the details) in the bylaws, so this sort of nonsense doesn't become any more of an issue.

[Weldon Merritt]

I'd suggest you formalize the procedure (with all the details) in the bylaws, so this sort of nonsense doesn't become any more of an issue.

Generally good advice. Unfortunately, Toastmasters International allows clubs very little leeway in the ciontents of its bylaws. In this instance, a Special Rule of Order may work better to speall out the details of the procedure.

[David A Foulkes]

Generally good advice. Unfortunately, Toastmasters International allows clubs very little leeway in the ciontents of its bylaws. In this instance, a Special Rule of Order may work better to speall out the details of the procedure.

Thanks for the input on TI, Weldon. So, in light of such "little leeway", I would think the process of accepting members would be clearly and unambiguously defined in the International/National bylaws such that the local chapters would have no confusion in this regard. Not so?

[Weldon Merritt]

So, in light of such "little leeway", I would think the process of accepting members would be clearly and unambiguously defined in the International/National bylaws such that the local chapters would have no confusion in this regard. Not so?

No; it is clear that members are supposed to be voted in, but TI provides no real guidance on the mechanics. I have been a member of a number of different Toastmasters clubs over the yeasrs, and each has handled it a little differently. In actuality, some just ignore the requirement and consider anyone who completes an application and pays dues to be a member. While I would never advise a club to ignore a provision in its bylaws, the reality is that despite the tight reain on the bylaws language, TI has no real enforcement mechanism to ensure that clubs comply. So long as a club sends in semiannual dues for the required minimum number of members, they generally are considered a club in good standing..

[tctheatc]

So for a vote to take place , a motion always has to be raised?

In my club's scenario If a motion is raised , matter becomes complex when the chair anounces that 'there is a motion on the floor to accept John Doe as a member ,raised and seconded by so and so respectively' and immediately after that asks the Sergeant @ arms to escort the candidate outside. Only once the candidate is outside can the chair open the motion for debate.

The part about asking the candidate to go utside does not fit in well with the motion. Because once the motion is raised there should be an immediate debate ,discussion and then a call for vote.

Now if its done like that then its not nice for a candidate to be seated inside while his acceptance is debated and discussed infront of him/her.

I maybe misinformed on the above.

If its considered normal parliamentary procedure to raise a motion for acceptance of a new member and the chair without debating the motion can ask the member to be escorted out , then I see no complex issues for a motion to be raised and this procedure to be followed.

Also I was reading about other clubs and how the VP Education/Membership just makes the announcement ,asks the candidate to be escorted outside and then the general assembly discuss about the candidate and call for a vote. Would that be wrong parliamentary procedure?

Is your angst over the issue that it's complex or that it's not nice? Because there should be nothing complex about a very simple motion to approve Joe BagO'Donuts as a member. Little bit of discussion ("he's swell" "he smells funny") and then vote yes or no. As for not nice, forgive me for suggesting you're creating your own problem by having Joe there before he's a member. Perhaps you might consider entertaining the motion to admit Joe as a member at a meeting where Joe is not invited. Then you don't have the apparently distasteful scenario of escorting him out or talking about him while he's there. If he's not there, you can text him that he's been voted in, and he can celebrate at home and come to the next meeting as a full member, or if he's turned down, save the embarrassment of having him find out in person.