Small board rules in committees

[Tomm]

Where 50:25 states that the procedures in small boards are used, "unless the committee is otherwise instructed by the society". 

What exactly does that mean?

Since the Board creates standing committees I assume it is the entire Board that is responsible for "instructing otherwise?" The Chair of the committee has no authority to do so on his/her own, nor does the committee have the power to establish its own rules unless it was granted that power.

Is it required to be documented either during the creation of the committee, by a special rule of order, or in the Minutes of a meeting by the Board after the committee has been well  established?  

I guess what I'm asking is can the committee be authorized to NOT use procedures in small boards by a simple comment made somewhere along the line or does it have to be a documented authorization?

[Joshua Katz]

It cannot be a "simply comment made somewhere along the line." Like all decisions of the parent assembly, it is done by a motion.

[Tomm]

On 10/23/2022 at 11:29 AM, Joshua Katz said:

Like all decisions of the parent assembly, it is done by a motion.

And, therefore, would be be required to be recorded/documented in the Minutes of that meeting.

[Richard Brown]

On 10/23/2022 at 1:40 PM, Tomm said:

And, therefore, would be be required to be recorded/documented in the Minutes of that meeting.

Yes, it SHOULD be recorded in the minutes, but the act of recording or documenting it  in the minutes is not necessary in order for the motion to be effective.  Being in the minutes is merely evidence of what was done.  Properly adopted motions are valid and in force regardless of whether they get entered in the minutes.  Not being recorded in the minutes just makes it harder to prove that something ever got adopted.

If the minutes are incorrect, they can be corrected at any time, even years later, by means of the motion to amend something previously adopted.

[Josh Martin]

On 10/23/2022 at 1:24 PM, Tomm said:

Where 50:25 states that the procedures in small boards are used, "unless the committee is otherwise instructed by the society". 

What exactly does that mean?

The rule in question is defined in more detail in the very next paragraph.

"Committees of organized societies operate under the bylaws, the parliamentary authority, and any special rules of order or standing rules of the society which may be applicable to them. A committee may not adopt its own rules except as authorized in the rules of the society or in instructions given to the committee by its parent assembly in a particular case. If a standing or special committee is so large that it can function best in the manner of a full-scale assembly, it should be instructed that the informalities and modifications of the regular rules of parliamentary procedure listed for small boards in 49:21 are not to apply to its proceedings. The parent assembly may adopt such instructions to the committee by majority vote." RONR (12th ed.) 50:26, emphasis added

I would also suggest to the Authorship Team that, for the sake of consistency with 50:26, the statement in 50:25 should say "parent assembly" rather than "society." Perhaps something to look at for the 13th edition.

On 10/23/2022 at 1:24 PM, Tomm said:

Since the Board creates standing committees I assume it is the entire Board that is responsible for "instructing otherwise?"

Yes. The complete statement of this rule in 50:26 is clearer on that point.

On 10/23/2022 at 1:24 PM, Tomm said:

The Chair of the committee has no authority to do so on his/her own, nor does the committee have the power to establish its own rules unless it was granted that power.

Yes, this is quite correct.

On 10/23/2022 at 1:24 PM, Tomm said:

Is it required to be documented either during the creation of the committee, by a special rule of order, or in the Minutes of a meeting by the Board after the committee has been well  established?  

It doesn't have to be a special rule of order, but I think you otherwise have this correct. Such instructions could be adopted either during the creation of the committee or in a motion to adopt subsequent instructions. Either of these motions should be recorded in the minutes.

"The motion to Commit requires a majority vote for its adoption even when it contains instructions that suspend, modify, or conflict with rules of order that would otherwise apply to meetings of the committee." RONR (12th ed.) 13:8

Since this involves standing committees and you refer several times to the "creation" of such committees, I would note that the following rule may be relevant.

"If certain standing committees are enumerated in the bylaws, no standing committees aside from those enumerated can be established without amending the bylaws, unless the bylaws also include a provision authorizing the creation of additional standing committees." RONR (12th ed.) 50:9

On 10/23/2022 at 1:24 PM, Tomm said:

I guess what I'm asking is can the committee be authorized to NOT use procedures in small boards by a simple comment made somewhere along the line or does it have to be a documented authorization?

No, a "simple comment" is not sufficient. It would have to be adopted by a motion.

On 10/23/2022 at 1:40 PM, Tomm said:

And, therefore, would be be required to be recorded/documented in the Minutes of that meeting.

Yes, but to be clear, in the event the assembly fails to record an action in the minutes, that does not invalidate the action. It just means the minutes need to be corrected.

Edited October 23, 2022 at 10:03 PM by Josh Martin

[Tomm]

On 10/23/2022 at 3:00 PM, Josh Martin said:

Yes, but to be clear, in the event the assembly fails to record an action in the minutes, that does not invalidate the action. It just means the minutes need to be corrected.

So I guess that means if the motion was passed a considerable amount of time ago but not recorded it becomes a he said, she said and/or the motion needs too be offered again?   

[Josh Martin]

On 10/23/2022 at 5:14 PM, Tomm said:

So I guess that means if the motion was passed a considerable amount of time ago but not recorded it becomes a he said, she said and/or the motion needs too be offered again?   

In the event there is disagreement over whether a motion on this matter was adopted at a previous meeting, then ultimately the board will need to resolve that disagreement when correcting the minutes, by vote.

See FAQ #16 concerning motions to correct minutes which have already been adopted.

https://robertsrules.com/frequently-asked-questions/