Bylaws allow proxy voting, silent on allowing proxy for quorum.

[Guest Jackson]

Condo Association Bylaws permit "proxy voting" but are silent on proxy being used for establishing a quorum.  The Bylaws specifically reference Robert's Rules apply.  A plain reading of Robert's Rules state quorum is determined by those present.  I understand counting those that called in via telephone as present because they are able to engage in discussion, so they seem to at least meet the intent of Robert's Rules for the purposes of quorum.  The proxy votes, however, seem to undermine the intent of a meeting under Robert's Rules since members can align absent support prior to any discussions and stack the meeting in the favor of those with member contact information (which is not disseminated due to "privacy" concerns!).  It would seem this violates Roberts Rules principles of establishing a quorum so deliberations have meaning.  Association Board members are insistent that proxy votes count towards quorum.  I cannot find this anywhere in Roberts Rules.  I raised an objection, but they proceeded with the meeting.  How can I connect the dots that bridge the simple, clear language in Robert's Rules to the Board's actions allowing proxy votes to be counted towards quorum?  Please cite specific clauses in Robert's Rules that allow the use of proxy votes to establish a quorum.

[Rob Elsman]

Since RONR (12th ed.) clearly states that it is a fundamental principle of parliamentary law that voting is limited to those who are actually present in the one room or area where the meeting is held, the book cannot be used to answer the question how the use of voting by proxy affects the requirement of a quorum.  Whatever rules give rise to the use of voting by proxy will have to also provide for whatever effect the use of proxies have on the requirement of a quorum.  In other words, you're on your own.

[Guest Jackson]

If I understand your point, Rob Elsman, if the Bylaws are silent on proxy votes counting towards quorum, and the Bylaws state quorum is established with 51% members "present" and then invoke Roberts Rules in the very next clause in the Bylaws, and RONR only allow members "present" to count towards quorum, then the logical conclusion is quorum is limited to members "present".  This line of reasoning would lead me to conclude a proxy vote is not a member that is "present" and the Association failed to meet quorum.  Do I have this correct?

[Atul Kapur]

If you only look at Robert's Rules of Order Newly Revised, then proxies are not allowed at all, so there's no further advice it provides (as Mr. Elsman said).

But there is more. It sounds like you have an issue of bylaws interpretation. As well, there is almost ccertainly a law about condo associations and boards in your jurisdiction that applies, and it may say something about this.

[Rob Elsman]

On 4/16/2024 at 3:58 PM, Guest Jackson said:

Do I have this correct?

It's your rule. You tell us.

[Atul Kapur]

On 4/16/2024 at 4:58 PM, Guest Jackson said:

This line of reasoning would lead me to conclude a proxy vote is not a member that is "present" and the Association failed to meet quorum.

This line of reasoning and this conclusion is what I meant when I said this was an issue of bylaw interpretation. The first principle of bylaws interpretation in RONR is 56:68 (1) Each society decides for itself the meaning of its bylaws. 

So it will be up to your organization to decide on how to interpret this question. Mr. Elsman says it in a different way.