President resigns, VP doesn't want it, who runs meeting for election?

[GrayMare]

I am the immediate Past President of an organization and trying to get answers to take back to our unit. I've read lots of the posts and found good information but would like something in writing.

The President says she has resigned and gave her briefcase to the Secretary. The 1st VP says she doesn't want to be President. The 2nd VP is also called Membership Chairman.

I have asked the President to put her resignation in writing. She didn't attend the last meeting and I ran the meeting as the 1st VP wasn't there and 2nd VP/Membership Chairman wasn't prepared to.

Should we call an Executive Board meeting to accept the resignation? (Our executive board consists of President, 1st VP, 2nd VP, Secretary, Treasurer, Historian, Chaplain, Sgt of Arms, retiring President and 2 additional members elected by the Unit.) OR should we wait until the next meeting and hope that she shows up or al least sends her letter of resignation?

Who runs the next meeting (Exective Board or regular meeting)? Secretary or can a Past President?

Can the next regular meeting be opened and nominations opened to elect a new President?

Does the 1st VP need to resign if she doesn't want to be President?

Can the 2nd VP remain as Membership Chairman.

Our bylaws only says if an elected officer doesn't attend 3 consecutive meetings, the office can be delared vacant and a new election held for that office. I don't think our unit can be in limbo for another 2 months.

[Guest Edgar]

A few things to consider:

A resignation is "a request to be excused from a duty". It doesn't have to be in writing (though it's better if it is) but it does have to be formally accepted by the body (or person) authorized to do so. Usually this is the body that elected the officer in the first place. So your board may (or may not) have the authority to accept (or reject) the resignation.

Secondly, once the president's resignation is accepted (if it is), the (first) VP becomes the president (and the other VPs move up and there's a vacancy in the office of the last VP). This is automatic. No one has a choice (other than to resign the new office).

Thirdly, if neither the president nor any of the vice-presidents are present at a meeting, the assembly (the members present) will elect a chair pro tem (a temporary presiding officer). It could be you or it could be anyone else (even someone who isn't a member at all).

Finally, you might want to post one question at a time.

[GrayMare]

Thanks for the reply, I put all of our questions in one post so I would have the answers together, could print and share with other members.

[Rev Ed]

I am the immediate Past President of an organization and trying to get answers to take back to our unit. I've read lots of the posts and found good information but would like something in writing.

The President says she has resigned and gave her briefcase to the Secretary. The 1st VP says she doesn't want to be President. The 2nd VP is also called Membership Chairman.

I have asked the President to put her resignation in writing. She didn't attend the last meeting and I ran the meeting as the 1st VP wasn't there and 2nd VP/Membership Chairman wasn't prepared to.

If the 2nd Vice President was present then he/she should have called the meeting to order. This is part of the duty of the position.

Should we call an Executive Board meeting to accept the resignation? (Our executive board consists of President, 1st VP, 2nd VP, Secretary, Treasurer, Historian, Chaplain, Sgt of Arms, retiring President and 2 additional members elected by the Unit.) OR should we wait until the next meeting and hope that she shows up or al least sends her letter of resignation?

Well who is responsible for accepting the resignation? Only that group allowed to accept the resignation can do so.

Who runs the next meeting (Exective Board or regular meeting)? Secretary or can a Past President?

Can the next regular meeting be opened and nominations opened to elect a new President?

Unless the By-laws state otherwise, the President if present would do so. If absent, the 1st Vice President would.

Does the 1st VP need to resign if she doesn't want to be President?

Yes.

Can the 2nd VP remain as Membership Chairman.

What do the By-laws state about this? How are the Vice Presidents elected? If the positions of "2nd Vice President" and "Membership Chairman" are separate but merely held by the same person then the current 2nd Vice Presidnent would become 1st Vice President but may remain Membership Chairman. However, if the 2nd Vice President is automatically Membership Chairman, then the new 2nd Vice President would become Membership Chairman.

Our bylaws only says if an elected officer doesn't attend 3 consecutive meetings, the office can be delared vacant and a new election held for that office. I don't think our unit can be in limbo for another 2 months.

If the By-laws are totally silent, then the general membership woud have to accept the resignation, the 1st Vice President is now the President, and the 2nd Vice President is now 1st Vice President, and the general membership would have to elect a new 2nd Vice President.

[Gary c Tesser]

If the 2nd Vice President was present then he/she should have called the meeting to order. This is part of the duty of the position.

Oh Edness. He/she was not prepared. Should an acknowledgedly incompetent (perhaps an overly harsh description) person preside, or should the assembly instead pick someone who can do the job at least passably?

Well[,] who is responsible for accepting the resignation? Only that group allowed to accept the resignation can do so.

Nicely put.

Unless the By-laws state otherwise, the President if present would do so. If absent, the 1st Vice President would.

The president who, even if present, is explicitly "out the door"? And Original Poster GrayMare said, "I ran the meeting as the 1st VP wasn't there." Ed, when you read, do you connect your optic nerves to anything behind them?

Yes.

Nicely put.

What do the By-laws state about this? How are the Vice Presidents elected? If the positions of "2nd Vice President" and "Membership Chairman" are separate but merely held by the same person then the current 2nd Vice Presidnent would become 1st Vice President but may remain Membership Chairman. However, if the 2nd Vice President is automatically Membership Chairman, then the new 2nd Vice President would become Membership Chairman.

Hey. Not bad.

If the By-laws are totally silent, then the general membership woud have to accept the resignation, the 1st Vice President is now the President, and the 2nd Vice President is now 1st Vice President, and the general membership would have to elect a new 2nd Vice President.

Ed, that's the 1st vice-president who is not willing to be the president, so you think that solves one problem? The second-vice-president was "not prepared to" preside, you think making her the president will solve another?

[sMargaret]

Ah yes, the very common "vice chair doesn't want to do the job of chair, but our chair has resigned" question. Perhaps this could be added to the FAQ?

For GrayMare, see page 452-453 of RONR, which explains an appointed chairman pro tem, and an elected chairman pro tem.

I will also note that you could have both vice president resign, and hold elections for president and both vice president positions. The same people could run again for vice president, and the members could well re-elect them (as long as they're not expecting them to carry out a very important part of being vice president).

By the way, assuming that the immediate past president position is part of the bylaws, and is defined solely as being the person who was the immediate past president, GrayMare will shortly no longer be the immediate past president, and will lose his/her position on the board. You may wish to consider in which order you accept resignations - consider if the president's resignation is accepted first, then the 1st vice president becomes president and says "heck, no, I'm not doing that!", that resignation is accepted, at which point the former 1st vice is now the immediate past president. This is one of the reasons that having an "immediate past president" in the bylaws isn't a great idea.

[GrayMare]

Ah yes, the very common "vice chair doesn't want to do the job of chair, but our chair has resigned" question. Perhaps this could be added to the FAQ?

For GrayMare, see page 452-453 of RONR, which explains an appointed chairman pro tem, and an elected chairman pro tem.

I will also note that you could have both vice president resign, and hold elections for president and both vice president positions. The same people could run again for vice president, and the members could well re-elect them (as long as they're not expecting them to carry out a very important part of being vice president).

By the way, assuming that the immediate past president position is part of the bylaws, and is defined solely as being the person who was the immediate past president, GrayMare will shortly no longer be the immediate past president, and will lose his/her position on the board. You may wish to consider in which order you accept resignations - consider if the president's resignation is accepted first, then the 1st vice president becomes president and says "heck, no, I'm not doing that!", that resignation is accepted, at which point the former 1st vice is now the immediate past president. This is one of the reasons that having an "immediate past president" in the bylaws isn't a great idea.

Thanks for your response.

.......

I will also note that you could have both vice president resign, and hold elections for president and both vice president positions. The same people could run again for vice president, and the members could well re-elect them (as long as they're not expecting them to carry out a very important part of being vice president)........

This is the solution I was looking for. seems simple and still follow rules.

.........

By the way, assuming that the immediate past president position is part of the bylaws, and is defined solely as being the person who was the immediate past president, GrayMare will shortly no longer be the immediate past president, and will lose his/her position on the board. You may wish to consider in which order you accept resignations - consider if the president's resignation is accepted first, then the 1st vice president becomes president and says "heck, no, I'm not doing that!", that resignation is accepted, at which point the former 1st vice is now the immediate past president. This is one of the reasons that having an "immediate past president" in the bylaws isn't a great idea.

I hadn't thought about this but at least the original President who resigned 1st won't be on the Executive Board. Should we ask they also resign from the Executive Board?

After this fiasco is settled, I'm making a motion to amend our bylaws to cover if the President resigns and how to handle it. I'm also going to suggest we remove the title of "2nd VP" and make it "Membership Chairman". Can we make a provision in the bylaws that if the President resigns, she loses her seat on the Executive Board?

[Guest Edgar]

Can we make a provision in the bylaws that if the President resigns, she loses her seat on the Executive Board?

Your bylaws can say whatever you want them to say. But you might want to get rid of the "immediate past president" nonsense altogether.

[Bruce Lages]

If you have adopted RONR in your bylaws as your parliamentary authority, then the succession of office - or offices, if there is more than one VP - when the presidency becomes vacant during the term of office (as described in RONR, 11th ed., p. 575, ll.6-17) is already a part of your bylaws. Unless you really want to create a different method for filling a presidential vacancy, there's no need to amend your bylaws.

Did you have some other vacancy-filling plan in mind?

[sMargaret]

After this fiasco is settled, I'm making a motion to amend our bylaws to cover if the President resigns and how to handle it. I'm also going to suggest we remove the title of "2nd VP" and make it "Membership Chairman". Can we make a provision in the bylaws that if the President resigns, she loses her seat on the Executive Board?

In what context? You already have a method for if the President resigns - the 1st vice president becomes president, and the president is logically then the immediate past president. However, your resigning president can't resign from being the immediate past president, if that's defined as just being an immediate past president.

You may wish to remove the immediate past president from your board (highly recommended), or perhaps redefine it in bylaws as the most recent past president who is willing and able to serve (in case you really think it's necessary to have someone on there like that). Depends on what your current bylaws say now.