Rockp2 Posted September 16, 2013 at 06:42 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 06:42 PM Setup: We are a POA. This is not a General Membership meeting. Just the Board holding an “Open” Board Meeting trying to conduct as much business as possible in front of the membership. We are not required to conduct any Board business in front of the membership, but choose to anyway. If you are holding a Board Meeting in front of the Membership, would the proper and best way to allow input from the audience during a specific topic be to “Suspend the Rules” for that part of the Board discussion, or could you move to “Commit” to Consider Informally? If during the same meeting any Board Member would have some input that they felt was sensitive (maybe listing a specific members name for example), is it best to move to “Postpone” until the next “Closed” Board Meeting, or would this be another place to “Commit” to the Board during a “Closed” Board Meeting. Since we are not required to hold Board meetings in front of the membership, historically we have not used the term “Executive Session”. I’m guessing that’s the reason. I just became President/Board Chairman and I’m working to improve our parliamentary procedure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted September 16, 2013 at 06:53 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 06:53 PM If you are holding a Board Meeting in front of the Membership, would the proper and best way to allow input from the audience during a specific topic be to “Suspend the Rules” for that part of the Board discussion, or could you move to “Commit” to Consider Informally? If the goal is to permit non-members (of the board) to speak in debate on a pending motion, Suspend the Rules is the way to go. Informal Consideration simply removes the restrictions on how many times members of the assembly may speak in debate on the main motion and its amendments. It doesn't permit non-members to speak. If during the same meeting any Board Member would have some input that they felt was sensitive (maybe listing a specific members name for example), is it best to move to “Postpone” until the next “Closed” Board Meeting, or would this be another place to “Commit” to the Board during a “Closed” Board Meeting. Neither. The board may enter executive session on the spot, but that is not a form of the motion to Commit. Rather, it is a Question of Privilege. See RONR, 11th ed., pgs. 229-230. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Harrison Posted September 16, 2013 at 06:53 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 06:53 PM Setup: We are a POA. This is not a General Membership meeting. Just the Board holding an “Open” Board Meeting trying to conduct as much business as possible in front of the membership. We are not required to conduct any Board business in front of the membership, but choose to anyway. If you are holding a Board Meeting in front of the Membership, would the proper and best way to allow input from the audience during a specific topic be to “Suspend the Rules” for that part of the Board discussion, or could you move to “Commit” to Consider Informally? It wouldn't do any good to Consider Informally since only the Board member would still have a right to speak in debate on the motion. Moving to Suspend the Rules to allow nonmembers (of the Board) to speak in debate would be proper. If during the same meeting any Board Member would have some input that they felt was sensitive (maybe listing a specific members name for example), is it best to move to “Postpone” until the next “Closed” Board Meeting, or would this be another place to “Commit” to the Board during a “Closed” Board Meeting.The Board member can move to go into Executive Session for that particular issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockp2 Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:14 PM Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:14 PM Thanks Gents. To clear up the the Executive Session part, we don't go into it. Historically (since long before I came along) we've held a second meeting every month for sensitive issues. It's a separate complete Board Meeting. So if in the middle of debate during an Open Board Meeting it was determined that the topic needed to be moved to the Closed Board Meeting, the topic wouldn't be postponed until that meeting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:24 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:24 PM If you are holding a Board Meeting in front of the Membership, would the proper and best way to allow input from the audience during a specific topic be to “Suspend the Rules” for that part of the Board discussion, Does anyone else but me think this is a really bad idea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:25 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:25 PM To clear up the the Executive Session part, we don't go into it. Well, I think you do. You apparently, however, do not go into executive session during an open meeting. To be sure we are on the same page, the term "executive session" in parliamentary usage means "any meeting of a deliberative assembly, or portion of a meeting, at which the proceedings are secret" (RONR, 11th ed., pg. 95, lines 16-18). So if in the middle of debate during an Open Board Meeting it was determined that the topic needed to be moved to the Closed Board Meeting, the topic wouldn't be postponed until that meeting? Not automatically. If the board wishes to postpone the motion to its next meeting (and thus keep its custom of keeping executive sessions separate), it is certainly free to do so. So back to your previous question - yes, if the board wishes to continue with this custom, the appropriate course of action for a more sensitive motion would be to postpone it to the next meeting. The motion to Commit is still not used for this purpose. Does anyone else but me think this is a really bad idea? I think it depends on how many of these guests wish to speak. If there's a large number of guests, it would certainly be wise to put some limits in when making the motion to Suspend the Rules. Alternately, for particularly important issues, the board might want to consider holding a hearing, as described in RONR, 11th ed., pg. 501, lines 7-13. While a hearing is a device normally used by a committee, it might also be useful for boards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockp2 Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:44 PM Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:44 PM Does anyone else but me think this is a really bad idea? I don't necessarily disagree with you. However, for at least as long as I've lived here (13 years), the Board has always done this. So the membership is very accustomed to it. A few times while I was Secretary I tried to explain to the President that historically we've been treating "Open" Board Meetings like mini-me-General Membership Meetings and he should stop asking the audience (membership) for input as we went through the all the topics. That would help get us more into the true Board Meeting role. He disagreed. Tonight, my first night in the Chair, I will be explaining that the audience can offer input and ask questions during the Open Forum part of the meeting after the Board has completed business. That should go over like a lead balloon. On one of our topics all the Board Members agree that we would like to engage the membership...that's reason for the first question (so we do it correctly). The reason for the second question (postponing) is because it may happen and I need to be prepared how to correctly handle it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:53 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:53 PM I think it depends on how many of these guests wish to speak. If there's a large number of guests, it would certainly be wise to put some limits in when making the motion to Suspend the Rules. Alternately, for particularly important issues, the board might want to consider holding a hearing, as described in RONR, 11th ed., pg. 501, lines 7-13. While a hearing is a device normally used by a committee, it might also be useful for boards. Exactly. A long line of non-members wishing to debate could make for a long night, and I don't know of any rule which would grant the board member any preference in recognition over the non-members, so making that motion to postpone might not be so easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Edgar Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:56 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:56 PM Tonight, my first night in the Chair, I will be explaining that the audience can offer input and ask questions during the Open Forum part of the meeting after the Board has completed business. Since the board has completed its business, why not simply adjourn the meeting (without making a big deal of it!) and indicate that board members will remain to listen to any concerns the general members may have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Harrison Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:58 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 07:58 PM Tonight, my first night in the Chair, I will be explaining that the audience can offer input and ask questions during the Open Forum part of the meeting after the Board has completed business. That should go over like a lead balloon.Just keep in mind that while it is fine for it to go over like a lead balloon with the non-Board members (procedurally at least) you will need to follow the Board's will if they decide that they want to allow nonmembers to speak in debate even though you haven't reached the Open Forum yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockp2 Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:00 PM Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:00 PM Exactly. A long line of non-members wishing to debate could make for a long night, and I don't know of any rule which would grant the board member any preference in recognition over the non-members, so making that motion to postpone might not be so easy. I should clarify...my questions were not concerning the same topic. As a matter of fact the second question was me trying to prepare for "what ifs" for possibles down the road. The Board has agreed that we are going to be very judicious on "Suspend the Rules". It will not be used for debate, but for input on a certain topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Harrison Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:01 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:01 PM I don't know of any rule which would grant the board member any preference in recognition over the non-members, so making that motion to postpone might not be so easy.Couldn't the motion to Suspend the Rules specify that Board members would have preference in recognition over the non Board member? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Harrison Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:03 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:03 PM The Board has agreed that we are going to be very judicious on "Suspend the Rules". It will not be used for debate, but for input on a certain topic. If there is a motion/topic pending any input on it would be debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:07 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:07 PM The Board has agreed that we are going to be very judicious on "Suspend the Rules". It will not be used for debate, but for input on a certain topic. Well, that clarification does help. If you're having non-members speak while no motion is pending, then Suspend the Rules isn't necessary - a majority vote will be sufficient. Couldn't the motion to Suspend the Rules specify that Board members would have preference in recognition over the non Board member? Sure. But since Suspend the Rules is neither debate nor amendable, it would probably be better to adopt rules of order for the session (or part of the session) if things start getting too complicated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockp2 Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:07 PM Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:07 PM Just keep in mind that while it is fine for it to go over like a lead balloon with the non-Board members (procedurally at least) you will need to follow the Board's will if they decide that they want to allow nonmembers to speak in debate even though you haven't reached the Open Forum yet. Understood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockp2 Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:13 PM Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:13 PM Well, that clarification does help. If you're having non-members speak while no motion is pending, then Suspend the Rules isn't necessary - a majority vote will be sufficient. So, are you saying that prior to the Main Motion, one could just move (and get a majority) to hear from the audience about the topic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:20 PM Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:20 PM So, are you saying that prior to the Main Motion, one could just move (and get a majority) to hear from the audience about the topic? Yes (although, as with Suspend the Rules, it may be wise to put some limitations on that). If you wait until the main motion is pending, Suspend the Rules would be required, which takes a 2/3 vote. As Mr. Harrison notes, any "input" on a pending motion is debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockp2 Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:23 PM Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 at 08:23 PM Yes (although, as with Suspend the Rules, it may be wise to put some limitations on that). If you wait until the main motion is pending, Suspend the Rules would be required, which takes a 2/3 vote. As Mr. Harrison notes, any "input" on a pending motion is debate. Thanks very much. I did not realize this option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shmuel Gerber Posted September 18, 2013 at 02:20 PM Report Share Posted September 18, 2013 at 02:20 PM Since the board has completed its business, why not simply adjourn the meeting (without making a big deal of it!) and indicate that board members will remain to listen to any concerns the general members may have?You mean the board doesn't disappear in a puff of smoke as soon as the board meeting is adjourned? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Edgar Posted September 18, 2013 at 08:02 PM Report Share Posted September 18, 2013 at 08:02 PM You mean the board doesn't disappear in a puff of smoke as soon as the board meeting is adjourned? The board does but the board members don't (and I suspect most in attendance won't notice the difference). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Billie Padilla Posted September 19, 2013 at 06:57 PM Report Share Posted September 19, 2013 at 06:57 PM I'm not certain I'm in the right forum and format, but here goes. My Home Owners Association is having an "Emergency Board Meeting" to discuss items that are relevant to the entire membership. Is it true that a non board member may attend? I thought that one may, but does not have a vote. Does one need to be invited by a board member, the entire board or can one just attend? Thank you. Billie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted September 19, 2013 at 07:03 PM Report Share Posted September 19, 2013 at 07:03 PM Is it true that a non board member may attend? No, unless the board permits it, or if the organization's rules so provide. Does one need to be invited by a board member, the entire board or can one just attend? Unless the organization's rules provide otherwise, it is up to the board to determine whether a non-board member may attend, by majority vote. For future reference, it's best to post a new question as a new topic, even if an existing topic seems similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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