Tom Coronite Posted January 29, 2015 at 01:58 PM Report Share Posted January 29, 2015 at 01:58 PM In three days we will elect a pastoral search committee whose task is to find a candidate for pastor in the church. Per our bylaws, the church will elect this committee by ballot. P 493 beginning at line 14 describes that we may designate a chair of this committee either as a position on the ballot (which we are not doing; the ballot is already prepared) or by an additional ballot. Are those two methods meant to be exclusively the only 2 ways the assembly can designate the committee chair? Or are they examples? P 176 beginning at line 7 says that the assembly has (at the time of the appointments) the opportunity to "designate" any one of them as chair. Would it be in order, in light of what is referenced on p. 493 above, to designate a chair via a motion? For example, "I move that Joe Bag'o'donuts serve as the chair" where Joe has been elected to the committee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted January 29, 2015 at 02:17 PM Report Share Posted January 29, 2015 at 02:17 PM Would it be in order, in light of what is referenced on p. 493 above, to designate a chair via a motion? For example, "I move that Joe Bag'o'donuts serve as the chair" where Joe has been elected to the committee.My interpretation, in reading the language on pages 176 and 493 together, is that the assembly can do it in a two step process and that the second step of selecting the chairman can be done by ballot, by motion, or by unanimous consent. I don't think the language in those two sections is intended to limit the assembly to voting by ballot for the chairman. First elect the members of the committee, then, on a second ballot or via a motion, select the chairman from among those chosen to be on the committee. Does that answer your question? If the assembly does not choose a chairman, then the committee itself would elect its own chairman from among its members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Coronite Posted January 29, 2015 at 05:34 PM Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2015 at 05:34 PM . Does that answer your question?Yes and no. It certainly answers it in the sense that I clearly get that at least one other person is of the mind that a motion to designate a chair would be proper. But I have no insight into why you believe that to be so. I'm not asking about how to go about choosing a chair, and what happens if the assembly doesn't.My question is how to interpret the assembly's option to "designate" a chair (p.176) in light of the 2 options listed on page 493. Those 2 options seem to be described as the only ways but I am left wondering if that is exactly what's meant whereas the text on p 176 does not specify. I could see interpreting it liberally, as p 176 seems broad. And I could see interpreting it narrowly, because why include only those 2 options if there are others? So while a poll of who sees it this way or that way might be interesting, I'm more looking for some other light to be shed, maybe a related reference I'm overlooking. Absent that, I am certainly good with the liberal interprretation and letting the assembly decide how to proceed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted January 29, 2015 at 07:37 PM Report Share Posted January 29, 2015 at 07:37 PM In three days we will elect a pastoral search committee whose task is to find a candidate for pastor in the church. Per our bylaws, the church will elect this committee by ballot. P 493 beginning at line 14 describes that we may designate a chair of this committee either as a position on the ballot (which we are not doing; the ballot is already prepared) or by an additional ballot. Are those two methods meant to be exclusively the only 2 ways the assembly can designate the committee chair? Or are they examples? P 176 beginning at line 7 says that the assembly has (at the time of the appointments) the opportunity to "designate" any one of them as chair. Would it be in order, in light of what is referenced on p. 493 above, to designate a chair via a motion? For example, "I move that Joe Bag'o'donuts serve as the chair" where Joe has been elected to the committee.I believe the assumption on pg. 493 is that if the assembly elects the committee's members by ballot, then the assembly would also wish to elect the chairman by ballot, but I do not think that RONR strictly requires this. Since your bylaws do require that the committee be elected by ballot, however, I think a reasonable argument could be made that the bylaws require the chairman to also be elected by ballot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted January 29, 2015 at 08:08 PM Report Share Posted January 29, 2015 at 08:08 PM I believe the assumption on pg. 493 is that if the assembly elects the committee's members by ballot, then the assembly would also wish to elect the chairman by ballot, but I do not think that RONR strictly requires this. Since your bylaws do require that the committee be elected by ballot, however, I think a reasonable argument could be made that the bylaws require the chairman to also be elected by ballot.Isn't it just as reasonable that, since the bylaws state that only that the committee shall be elected by ballot, with no mention of the chairman, that selecting the chairman by ballot is not required? That seems to be in line with principle of interpretation No 4 starting on page 589. Regardless of how it can be interpreted, which is ultimately up to the assembly, I'm curious as to whether you personally believe that the bylaws require that the chairman be selected by ballot. I think we all agree that RONR does not require it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Mervosh Posted January 29, 2015 at 09:03 PM Report Share Posted January 29, 2015 at 09:03 PM Isn't it just as reasonable that, since the bylaws state that only that the committee shall be elected by ballot, with no mention of the chairman, that selecting the chairman by ballot is not required? That seems to be in line with principle of interpretation No 4 starting on page 589. Regardless of how it can be interpreted, which is ultimately up to the assembly, I'm curious as to whether you personally believe that the bylaws require that the chairman be selected by ballot. I think we all agree that RONR does not require it. Josh can answer for himself, but I agree with his leaning. An essential element of electing a committee is electing the chairman, and I think the same rules should apply unless expressly stated otherwise. But that's just my take on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Brown Posted January 29, 2015 at 10:11 PM Report Share Posted January 29, 2015 at 10:11 PM Josh can answer for himself, but I agree with his leaning. An essential element of electing a committee is electing the chairman, and I think the same rules should apply unless expressly stated otherwise. But that's just my take on it.Or, per the language on page 176 of RONR, decline to designate a chairman, in which case the committee elects its own chairman. The assembly is not required to select the chairman: "If the committee is named by a power other than the chair (such as the assembly or the executive board), the body that elects the committee members has the power, at the time the appointments are made, to designate any one of them as chairman. If a chairman is not designated when the committee is appointed, the committee has the right to elect its own chairman. In the latter case, the first-named member has the duty of calling the committee together and of acting as temporary chairman until the committee elects a chairman." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted January 29, 2015 at 11:39 PM Report Share Posted January 29, 2015 at 11:39 PM Isn't it just as reasonable that, since the bylaws state that only that the committee shall be elected by ballot, with no mention of the chairman, that selecting the chairman by ballot is not required? That seems to be in line with principle of interpretation No 4 starting on page 589.Regardless of how it can be interpreted, which is ultimately up to the assembly, I'm curious as to whether you personally believe that the bylaws require that the chairman be selected by ballot. I think we all agree that RONR does not require it.Barring anything else in the bylaws on the subject, my interpretation would be that if the assembly elects the chairman, it must do so by ballot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Coronite Posted January 30, 2015 at 03:30 AM Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 at 03:30 AM Interesting! Many thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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