Those in attendance hear the facts, proxy votes do not get all the facts

[Guest Gary Brookes]

I am chairing a meeting tonight where one side has gathered a substantive number of proxy votes.  The "other side' is prepared to make a motion that only those who attend the meeting get to hear the facts, in keeping with a superior organization's ( to us ) directive.  Therefore, only those in attendance who hear all the facts have the right to vote.

 

Is there anything that will guide a novice chairman in dealing with what I expect to be a major challenge to this motion ?

[Edgar Guest]

This is one of the reasons RONR doesn't endorse the use of proxies (see FAQ #10).

 

Edited at 4:15 to add: One of the advantages of proxies is that the holder of the proxy is present and will "get to hear the facts". So, unless the proxy says to vote "yes" (or "no") regardless of what happens, the proxy holder is free to vote the way he thinks the absent member would have voted if he were present.

[jstackpo]

Yeah, read your rules, as they pertain to proxies VERY CAREFULLY  (and that mysterious "directive" from above).   That will tell you if you have a leg to stand on. And then read up on point of order and appeal - p. 247ff.

 

RONR doesn't have detail rules about proxy votes, so the book can't help you.

[Guest Gary Brookes]

thanks folks,  i've got a real dogs' breakfast coming at me ( and not of my doing ) so I'm a bit frazzled at this stage on preparation.

[Richard Brown]

Is there anything that will guide a novice chairman in dealing with what I expect to be a major challenge to this motion ?

Yes, your bylaws.  What do they say?  If they say proxies are allowed, then they are allowed.  Period. 

 

If they say proxies are not allowed, then they are not allowed....period.... unless state law says they must be allowed. 

 

If your bylaws don't mention proxies and RONR is your parliamentary authority, then they are not allowed.... unless state law says they must be allowed.   Edited to add:  See pages 428-429.

 

Note:  If you are subject to the bylaws of some superior organization, such as a national "parent" organization, the provisions of THAT organization's bylaws might dictate what you need to do.

[jstackpo]

thanks folks,  i've got a real dogs' breakfast coming at me ( and not of my doing ) so I'm a bit frazzled at this stage on preparation.

 

Don't forget (no matter how you personally feel about the issue) that your job as chairman is to facilitate the will of the majority (possibly including all those proxies) and NOT enter into the debate on the issue.

 

You are supposed to rule on points of order, but those rulings are ALL subject to appeal.  The membership, ultimately, decides, not you, so what's to worry about?  Being chairman in a controversial context is the easiest of all jobs  --  just let the majority have its way and nobody will be sore at you.

[Edgar Guest]

  . . . just let the majority have its way and nobody will be sore at you.

 

Except, perhaps, the minority.

[Richard Brown]

Don't forget (no matter how you personally feel about the issue) that your job as chairman is to facilitate the will of the majority (possibly including all those proxies) and NOT enter into the debate on the issue.

 

You are supposed to rule on points of order, but those rulings are ALL subject to appeal.  The membership, ultimately, decides, not you, so what's to worry about?  Being chairman in a controversial context is the easiest of all jobs  --  just let the majority have its way and nobody will be sore at you.

Very good advice.  And if our guest wants guidance on how to submit such a question directly to the assembly without making a ruling on it himself, he can see page 254:

 

"When the chair is in doubt as to how to rule on an important point, he can submit it to the assembly for decision in some such manner as:

CHAIR: Mr. Downey raises a point of order that the amendment is not germane to the resolution. The chair is in doubt and submits the question to the assembly. The resolution is [reading it]. The proposed  amendment is [reading it]. The question is, "Is the amendment germane to the resolution?"

 

There is no appeal from a question submitted directly to the assembly since the assembly is the final arbiter.