Putting rescind of a motion on agenda

[Wild Dunes]

For our HOA monthly board meetings, board members receive an agenda of the meeting that includes supporting paperwork to business items. That agenda lists Unfinished Business and New Business among other topics.

In March 2021 we approved a motion under New Business, say it was 03.01.21.

We now need to rescind that motion.

Question:  In putting this on our next agenda, would the action be given a new New Business item number, e.g. 03.03.22, or would we put it under Unfinished Business using the original item number 03.01.21?

[Josh Martin]

On 2/18/2022 at 12:14 PM, Wild Dunes said:

Question:  In putting this on our next agenda, would the action be given a new New Business item number, e.g. 03.03.22, or would we put it under Unfinished Business using the original item number 03.01.21?

It is New Business.

Edited February 18, 2022 at 07:59 PM by Josh Martin

[Dan Honemann]

On 2/18/2022 at 1:58 PM, Josh Martin said:

It is New Business.

Except that, if you put this on an agenda which is then adopted (why you would be adopting an agenda for your monthly board meetings is a mystery to me), it will not be new business. It will be either a special order or a general order, depending upon whether or not your agenda sets a particular hour for its consideration.

[Wild Dunes]

On 2/18/2022 at 11:10 AM, Dan Honemann said:

Except that, if you put this on an agenda which is then adopted (why you would be adopting an agenda for your monthly board meetings is a mystery to me), it will not be new business. It will be either a special order or a general order, depending upon whether or not your agenda sets a particular hour for its consideration.

I'm sorry but I am not understanding your reply. Are you saying that we don't have to adopt an agenda each month, even if that agenda changes, particularly as relates to business items. I am a newbie to understanding RONR so please excuse my lack of knowledge. I can only say that historically, our board has a new agenda for each month's meeting and that agenda includes New Business which are new items of business for the board to consider at that meeting. 

[Wild Dunes]

On 2/18/2022 at 10:58 AM, Josh Martin said:

It is New Business.

Thank you. That is my understanding also, but definitely needed confirmation.

[Dan Honemann]

On 2/19/2022 at 7:03 AM, Wild Dunes said:

I'm sorry but I am not understanding your reply. Are you saying that we don't have to adopt an agenda each month, even if that agenda changes, particularly as relates to business items. I am a newbie to understanding RONR so please excuse my lack of knowledge. I can only say that historically, our board has a new agenda for each month's meeting and that agenda includes New Business which are new items of business for the board to consider at that meeting. 

Before we get too far into this, let me ask you: has your HOA adopted RONR as its parliamentary authority?

[Josh Martin]

On 2/19/2022 at 6:04 AM, Wild Dunes said:

Thank you. That is my understanding also, but definitely needed confirmation.

Well, Mr. Honemann is correct. I got caught up in the Unfinished Business vs. New Business distinction. In reality, it is neither of these. An item placed on an adopted agenda becomes a general order or a special order. New Business is for items which aren't listed on the agenda.

On 2/19/2022 at 6:03 AM, Wild Dunes said:

I'm sorry but I am not understanding your reply. Are you saying that we don't have to adopt an agenda each month, even if that agenda changes, particularly as relates to business items. I am a newbie to understanding RONR so please excuse my lack of knowledge. I can only say that historically, our board has a new agenda for each month's meeting and that agenda includes New Business which are new items of business for the board to consider at that meeting. 

Under the rules in RONR, if an assembly meets at least quarterly, the assembly is supposed to use the standard order of business in RONR (or a special order of business adopted by the assembly) rather than adopting an agenda for every meeting. What exactly the standard order of business entails is discussed in RONR (12th ed.) 41:5-36.

But I wouldn't feel too bad about this. The misperception that the correct procedure is for every assembly to adopt an agenda for every meeting is extremely widespread.

[Rob Elsman]

On 2/19/2022 at 9:41 AM, Josh Martin said:

...extremely widespread.

...and causes all kinds of confusion, as this forum amply demonstrates.  The authors cannot help but to have noticed this.  Hmm.  Just thinking aloud.  I wonder if it would be possible to convince one of the authors to present a webinar on the subject and put it up on the web.  🤔

[Wild Dunes]

On 2/19/2022 at 4:30 AM, Dan Honemann said:

Before we get too far into this, let me ask you: has your HOA adopted RONR as its parliamentary authority?

Our Bylaws state "The current edition of Robert's Rules of Orders Newly Revised shall govern the proceedings of the Corporation in all cases not provided for in these Bylaws." Our problem is that historically the board plays kind of loose with RONR. It has only been recently that the board has begun to acknowledge a need for parliamentary implementation.  In reading more on this, it would seem that our management (the board) many years back, prior to my residence and prior to my being on the board, adopted something more akin to the special order of business.

[Wild Dunes]

On 2/19/2022 at 7:41 AM, Josh Martin said:

Well, Mr. Honemann is correct. I got caught up in the Unfinished Business vs. New Business distinction. In reality, it is neither of these. An item placed on an adopted agenda becomes a general order or a special order. New Business is for items which aren't listed on the agenda.

Under the rules in RONR, if an assembly meets at least quarterly, the assembly is supposed to use the standard order of business in RONR (or a special order of business adopted by the assembly) rather than adopting an agenda for every meeting. What exactly the standard order of business entails is discussed in RONR (12th ed.) 41:5-36.

But I wouldn't feel too bad about this. The misperception that the correct procedure is for every assembly to adopt an agenda for every meeting is extremely widespread.

Thank you for the referral to RONR (12th ed.) 41:5-36. I have read through it and will re-read it. In reading this, it would appear to me that our management, many years ago (as it would be prior to my being an owner in the association and before my involvement as a board member) adopted something such as or similar to the special order of business. 

[Josh Martin]

On 2/20/2022 at 12:16 AM, Wild Dunes said:

Thank you for the referral to RONR (12th ed.) 41:5-36. I have read through it and will re-read it. In reading this, it would appear to me that our management, many years ago (as it would be prior to my being an owner in the association and before my involvement as a board member) adopted something such as or similar to the special order of business. 

If the board did in fact adopt a special order of business, then in that case, the special order of business should be followed at each meeting.

[Dan Honemann]

On 2/20/2022 at 12:12 PM, Josh Martin said:

If the board did in fact adopt a special order of business, then in that case, the special order of business should be followed at each meeting.

Assuming they can find it.  🙂

[Wild Dunes]

On 2/20/2022 at 9:24 AM, Dan Honemann said:

Assuming they can find it.  🙂

Yes 😏

Thank you, Mr. Martin and Mr. Honemann.

[Gary Novosielski]

On 2/20/2022 at 1:16 AM, Wild Dunes said:

Thank you for the referral to RONR (12th ed.) 41:5-36. I have read through it and will re-read it. In reading this, it would appear to me that our management, many years ago (as it would be prior to my being an owner in the association and before my involvement as a board member) adopted something such as or similar to the special order of business. 

Although it may have antedated your involvement, if a special rule of order was adopted, there should be some written evidence of the fact that survives to the present day.  If not, I would suspect this may be nothing more than a custom.

[Wild Dunes]

On 2/22/2022 at 4:42 PM, Gary Novosielski said:

Although it may have antedated your involvement, if a special rule of order was adopted, there should be some written evidence of the fact that survives to the present day.  If not, I would suspect this may be nothing more than a custom.

Very possible that it is a custom. Something more to research here in our files.

[Rob Elsman]

On 2/20/2022 at 12:12 AM, Wild Dunes said:

...historically the board plays kind of loose with RONR.

Why, I've never heard of such a thing!  😂

[Gary Novosielski]

On 2/23/2022 at 1:07 PM, Rob Elsman said:

Why, I've never heard of such a thing!  😂

Yes, I'm sure we are all shocked; shocked.