Parliamentarian

[Guest harry]

Although the parliamentarian is supposed to not vote or debate, if they are a dual office holder (subcommittee chair) that is allowed to vote and debate, may they do so under that title?

[hmtcastle]

Although the parliamentarian is supposed to not vote or debate, if they are a dual office holder (subcommittee chair) that is allowed to vote and debate, may they do so under that title?

No. The parliamentarian's hat can't be removed.

[Chris Harrison]

No.

[Guest Arnold]

Yes...If the groups standing rules specifically give voting power to the other position, they may vote and debate.

[Chris Harrison]

Yes...If the groups standing rules specifically give voting power to the other position, they may vote and debate.

Nope. I would direct you to RONR p. 451. If this member wants to exercise the rights of membership he should not have accepted the duties of being parliamentarian.

[Tim Wynn]

Yes...If the groups standing rules specifically give voting power to the other position, they may vote and debate.

Standing Rules don't give voting power.

[Tim Wynn]

Although the parliamentarian is supposed to not vote or debate, if they are a dual office holder (subcommittee chair) that is allowed to vote and debate, may they do so under that title?

A parliamentarian does not "vote on any question except in the case of a ballot vote." See RONR(10th ed.), p. 451, l. 4-8.

Also, "He does not cast a deciding vote, even if his vote would affect the result, since that would interfere with the chair's prerogative of doing so." - RONR(10th ed.), p. 451, l. 8-10. So, if he is the chair of a subcommittee, his refraining from voting in that subcommittee would not actually serve the purpose for the rule, HOWEVER, taking a position on an issue inside a subcommittee would violate his duty to maintain a position of impartiality within the organization.

Being the chair of a subcommittee even violates the definition of his job, "The parliamentarian's role during a meeting is purely an advisory and consultative one..." - RONR(10th ed.), p. 449, l. 7-8.

[edited to change spacing of sentences... and to annoy Mr. Mountcastle.]

[Tim Wynn]

Yes...If the groups standing rules specifically give voting power to the other position, they may vote and debate.

It's not a good idea to disagree with Chris H and Mr. Mountcastle, especially when they concur with one another.

[alanh49]

It's not a good idea to disagree with Chris H and Mr. Mountcastle, especially when they concur with one another.

Well I'm going to disagree anyway because if the member parliamentarian is the subcommittee's chair and not its parliamentarian why would the limitations on what a member parliamentarian can do apply?

Nothing in RONR says that a member parliamentarian can't serve on or chair a subcommittee or even a committee.

[Ann Rempel]

Well I'm going to disagree anyway because if the member parliamentarian is the subcommittee's chair and not its parliamentarian why would the limitations on what a member parliamentarian can do apply?

Nothing in RONR says that a member parliamentarian can't serve on or chair a subcommittee or even a committee.

I think RONR makes it clear that the parliamentarian should remain impartial. The chair of a committee or subcommittee is not an impartial position. If the parliamentarian is assigned to work with a committee or subcommittee, his or her role should be that of an adviser on parliamentary procedure.

[Dan Honemann]

Well I'm going to disagree anyway because if the member parliamentarian is the subcommittee's chair and not its parliamentarian why would the limitations on what a member parliamentarian can do apply?

Nothing in RONR says that a member parliamentarian can't serve on or chair a subcommittee or even a committee.

I agree.

I think the others are thinking of situations in which the parliamentarian serves on a board or committee as its parliamentarian.

[Trina]

Well I'm going to disagree anyway because if the member parliamentarian is the subcommittee's chair and not its parliamentarian why would the limitations on what a member parliamentarian can do apply?

Nothing in RONR says that a member parliamentarian can't serve on or chair a subcommittee or even a committee.

Would you agree that if the sub-committee chair is normally allowed to debate and vote in the larger assembly, simply by virtue of being chair of that sub-committee (which I think is what the original poster was suggesting), that the parliamentarian-who-is-also-sub-committee-chair should nonetheless refrain from debating and voting in the larger assembly?

But that the parliamentarian would still be perfectly capable of BEING the chair of a committee or sub-committee, and capable of exercising full rights of participation while acting within the committee or sub-committee?

[Guest Camellia Rose]

This is an interesting question. I looked for this in RONR and could not find it. Please tell me where I can find it. The President of my organization recently appointed me as Parliamentarian. I totally understand the requirement for impartially in this role and decided to: "to not exercise my right to vote" (p. 451, l. 15 during our monthly meetings....HOWEVER, our Bylaws list the "Bylaws Committee" as a standing Committee. "This committee shall consist of the Parliamentarian as chair, the Corresponding Sevretary, and at least two other members appointed by the President. This committee shall make the appropriate revisions to the Chapter's documents and execute other changes desired by the Chapter. It shall maintain and update the Bylaws and Standing Rules of the Chapter as required". I'm reasoning that as chair of this committee, I still must remain impartial and not vote or participate in debate. Any advice? Thanks in advance!

[Dan Honemann]

This is an interesting question. I looked for this in RONR and could not find it. Please tell me where I can find it. The President of my organization recently appointed me as Parliamentarian. I totally understand the requirement for impartially in this role and decided to: "to not exercise my right to vote" (p. 451, l. 15 during our monthly meetings....HOWEVER, our Bylaws list the "Bylaws Committee" as a standing Committee. "This committee shall consist of the Parliamentarian as chair, the Corresponding Sevretary, and at least two other members appointed by the President. This committee shall make the appropriate revisions to the Chapter's documents and execute other changes desired by the Chapter. It shall maintain and update the Bylaws and Standing Rules of the Chapter as required". I'm reasoning that as chair of this committee, I still must remain impartial and not vote or participate in debate. Any advice? Thanks in advance!

You may fully participate in meetings of the committee, but you should not do so at meetings of the general membership where you are serving as parliamentarian.