Guest Patti Posted February 12, 2011 at 04:24 AM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 04:24 AM In RONR IN Brief, page 61-62, referring to a motion to rescind- "If previous notice is given"- FACTS- General assembly not allowed at board meetings, only one general meeting per year, consequently can't give notice at previous meeting. Secretary will not include in the call of the meeting because it is her election that we want to rescind.Are we then stuck having to make a motion (no previous notice given) at the upcoming general meeting (end of February)? Then we will have to have a 2/3 vote to rescind last year's election. Am I correct so far ?When should this motion be made ? If there is an agenda (which I doubt), can we move to vote on amending the agenda to add "vote on motion to rescind last years election" ORDo we wait for new business to make a motion to rescind last years election. HELP !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tctheatc Posted February 12, 2011 at 04:29 AM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 04:29 AM I'm unclear on a few things (for example, whether we're talking board or general assembly) but I'd point out that previous notice need not be given at a meeting. e.g. Mailings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted February 12, 2011 at 05:10 AM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 05:10 AM Are we then stuck having to make a motion (no previous notice given) at the upcoming general meeting (end of February)?Looks like it.Then we will have to have a 2/3 vote to rescind last year's election. Am I correct so far ?Correct. And while you're at it, double-check FAQ #20 and the language in your Bylaws to see if you can rescind the election at all.When should this motion be made ?During New Business.If there is an agenda (which I doubt), can we move to vote on amending the agenda to add "vote on motion to rescind last years election" OR Do we wait for new business to make a motion to rescind last years election.Either way is fine.I'm unclear on a few things (for example, whether we're talking board or general assembly) but I'd point out that previous notice need not be given at a meeting. e.g. MailingsThe only mailing which counts for previous notice is including the notice in the call of the meeting. The Secretary sends out the call of the meeting, and it appears the Secretary is including to include the notice. So there's really no way for them to provide previous notice, but hopefully this additional evidence of the Secretary's misconduct will get them the votes they need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tctheatc Posted February 12, 2011 at 12:29 PM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 12:29 PM RONR p 118 l 20-30 speak to the mailing. The secretary SHOULD include this notice at the expense of the assembly at a member's request. Whereas the secretary appears obstinate, you don't suppose another person could do the mailing? The paragraph refers to the notice being sent WITH the call, which I suppose could mean 2 separate sheets of paper, 2 separate items. So my question: if it were done by someone other than the secretary, could it be construed as fulfilling this definition of notice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Patti Posted February 12, 2011 at 04:53 PM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 04:53 PM to tctheac- We are talking about the upcoming annual general assembly meetingWe have sent a Registered letter to the secretary requesting the item be placed with the call of the meeting, but of course she refused to sign for the letter. The bylaws do have the "OR" in it which would allow us to rescind the election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Harrison Posted February 12, 2011 at 05:42 PM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 05:42 PM to tctheac- We are talking about the upcoming annual general assembly meetingWe have sent a Registered letter to the secretary requesting the item be placed with the call of the meeting, but of course she refused to sign for the letter. The bylaws do have the "OR" in it which would allow us to rescind the election.What about the President (or some other officer) go with another member or two goes to the Secretary's home and hand delivers the letter to her. The extra member or two would be witnesses to the letter being given to the Secretary. If she still refuses to send out the notice I have an idea that I hope the others can weigh in on...If the Secretary was still to refuse to send out the notice and another member (perhaps the President) were to send out the notice instead would there be a page 244 violation that would render the notice (and thus rescission of the election if adopted by majority vote) invalid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Elsman Posted February 12, 2011 at 08:30 PM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 08:30 PM to tctheac- We are talking about the upcoming annual general assembly meetingWe have sent a Registered letter to the secretary requesting the item be placed with the call of the meeting, but of course she refused to sign for the letter. The bylaws do have the "OR" in it which would allow us to rescind the election.I think you need the assistance of an attorney who can tell you how to sue the living how to proceed with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted February 12, 2011 at 09:54 PM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 09:54 PM Whereas the secretary appears obstinate, you don't suppose another person could do the mailing? The paragraph refers to the notice being sent WITH the call, which I suppose could mean 2 separate sheets of paper, 2 separate items. So my question: if it were done by someone other than the secretary, could it be construed as fulfilling this definition of notice?The problem is that the Secretary (as I understand it) will be sending out the call but will not be including the notice with the call of the meeting. If the Secretary was refusing to send the call out at all we might have some wiggle room, but if two calls of the meeting are sent out, the call from the Secretary is clearly what counts. Sending out an extra call will only confuse the members.We have sent a Registered letter to the secretary requesting the item be placed with the call of the meeting, but of course she refused to sign for the letter. The bylaws do have the "OR" in it which would allow us to rescind the election.Yeah, I think you're going to need a 2/3 vote, but I can't imagine that will be too difficult to get with this new information. If the Secretary was still to refuse to send out the notice and another member (perhaps the President) were to send out the notice instead would there be a page 244 violation that would render the notice (and thus rescission of the election if adopted by majority vote) invalid?There certainly will not be a pg. 244 violation. Official Interpretation 2006-18 would apply, but I believe the President should use the higher voting thresholds in this instance.I think you need the assistance of an attorney who can tell you how to sue the living how to proceed with this.The fact that there is no previous notice just means that a 2/3 vote will be required. I see no reason to get an attorney involved (yet). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Patti Posted February 12, 2011 at 11:10 PM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 11:10 PM The hand delivery part was tried with two witnesses, she never came to the door (car was in driveway). OH and BTW the president is also her son, living in the same household ! Howdya like that one. We want him gone as well. Same plan, rescinding last years election.If we are successful in a 2/3 vote, can we hold an election at the same general meeting, if so who would chair the nominations and balloting. Can a member be voted in as Pro-tem for that meeting or would the Vice Pres. become the chair for the purpose of the rest of that meeting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Schafer Posted February 12, 2011 at 11:25 PM Report Share Posted February 12, 2011 at 11:25 PM If we are successful in a 2/3 vote, can we hold an election at the same general meeting?For filling vacancies due to the removal of an officer by rescinding the election, notice is required to hold the election, unless the bylaws give some other method of filling the vacancy or give a different procedure. (RONR 10th ed., p. 279, l. 24-30.) Since your secretary won't send a notice to rescind the election, it's not likely that the members would receive notice of an election for her replacement. You'll need to have another meeting to fill the vacancy, with the required notice for the election.Can a member be voted in as Pro-tem for that meeting or would the Vice Pres. become the chair for the purpose of the rest of that meeting?If the president is removed from office, the vice president immediately becomes the president, unless your bylaws state otherwise. Then, the vacancy and subsequent election would be in the office of vice president.If the secretary is removed from office, the first thing the assembly should do is to elect a secretary pro tem to prepare the minutes for that meeting. The chair can use the same procedure at the beginning of every meeting until a secretary is elected to fill the vacancy.(Edited to add information regarding secretary pro tem.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert B Fish Posted February 13, 2011 at 12:25 AM Report Share Posted February 13, 2011 at 12:25 AM However, if the motion were made, "That the rules be suspended and Mr. White be appointed president pro tem to preside during the meeting." (2/3 vote required) If that motion passes, then Mr. White and not the chairman or vice-chairman would preside.The office of president is not vacant. He/she is still the president but he's just not presiding.-Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Novosielski Posted February 13, 2011 at 03:29 AM Report Share Posted February 13, 2011 at 03:29 AM If we are successful in a 2/3 vote, can we hold an election at the same general meeting, if so who would chair the nominations and balloting. Can a member be voted in as Pro-tem for that meeting or would the Vice Pres. become the chair for the purpose of the rest of that meeting?If you have 2/3 with you, you can suspend the rules and put whomever you like in the chair, pro tem. Elections, however, require prior notice, unless this is your regular Annual Meeting, where elections are assumed to be and normally are, held. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Martin Posted February 13, 2011 at 04:23 AM Report Share Posted February 13, 2011 at 04:23 AM Elections, however, require prior notice, unless this is your regular Annual Meeting, where elections are assumed to be and normally are, held.Well, the original post said the general membership has only one meeting per year, so it's definitely the annual meeting. I suspect that the officers serve a term of more than one year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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