ByLaws Overriding Special Resolution

[Unrealz]

Hi All,

Curious if anyone knows based on RONR whether an explicit bylaw (with not exceptions) override a special resolution that conflicts with this bylaw.? 
I recall somewhere in RONR that discuss how any business (including special resolution) of membership is void if bylaws that state otherwise conflict with it.

Thanks!

[jstackpo]

You bet it does:  page 251, subparagraph a).

[Unrealz]

30 minutes ago, jstackpo said:

You bet it does:  page 251, subparagraph a).

Thanks jstackpo, however for page 251 (a) doesnt this require to be a point of order that will be raised by a member at a meeting?

What if the special resolution has already been passed and meeting ended (The point of order likely can't be raised until the next meeting)? Does this mean that part of the special resolution becomes void? Is there another part of RONR that states this?

Thanks!

[Richard Brown]

46 minutes ago, Unrealz said:

Thanks jstackpo, however for page 251 (a) doesnt this require to be a point of order that will be raised by a member at a meeting?

What if the special resolution has already been passed and meeting ended (The point of order likely can't be raised until the next meeting)? Does this mean that part of the special resolution becomes void? Is there another part of RONR that states this?

Thanks!

It does require a point of order to have an adopted motion declared void as conflicting with the bylaws.  As to timeliness, a motion which conflicts with the bylaws is a continuing breach and a point of order can be raised at any time (but only in a meeting) as long as the breach continues.

Edited to add:  You might find the following language from page 251 of RONR on point:

"The only exceptions to the rule that a point of order must be made at the time of the breach arise in connection with breaches that are of a continuing nature, in which case a point of order can be made at any time during the continuance of the breach. Instances of this kind occur when:
    a)    a main motion has been adopted that conflicts with the bylaws (or constitution) of the organization or assembly,"

Edited January 20, 2017 at 07:38 PM by Richard Brown
Added last paragraph

[Unrealz]

Thanks Richard Brown.

One follow up question: Therefore, is the conflicting Special Resolution (where no point of order is made) still "valid" until a future point of order is made?

[Hieu H. Huynh]

It is not valid if it is null and void.

[Unrealz]

Thanks for comments Hieu Huynh.

Based on Mr. Brown's comment, the resolution becomes void upon a point of order being raised at the subsequent meeting. My follow up was question is asking whether in the interim (till this point of order) this special resolution is considered as valid or not. 

(Also, Thanks Mr. Brown for the wording in RONR, i saw that section as well but again my question is regarding the interim period until the next meeting (where point of order may be raised).

 

[Dan Honemann]

Well, first of all, what's the difference between a "special resolution" and one that isn't "special"?

[Guest Who's Coming to Dinner]

1 hour ago, Unrealz said:

My follow up was question is asking whether in the interim (till this point of order) this special resolution is considered as valid or not.

Consider by whom? By your assembly? Not until they assemble and declare it invalid. The real question is: what should you do about it until the next meeting? If you take some action in contravention to this resolution, then you risk becoming very unpopular in your organization should they decide it doesn't conflict with the bylaws.

[Hieu H. Huynh]

How does this resolution conflict with the bylaws?

[Joshua Katz]

3 hours ago, Unrealz said:

Based on Mr. Brown's comment, the resolution becomes void upon a point of order being raised at the subsequent meeting. My follow up was question is asking whether in the interim (till this point of order) this special resolution is considered as valid or not. 

 

Exactly.  You have to think about why the point of order must be raised at a meeting: because that's where we can decide if, in fact, it conflicts or not.  Otherwise, how do we know it conflicts?  Just your word?  But your decision is not final; that of the assembly is.  So until that happens, nothing makes it void.  There may well be an argument that it does not conflict with the bylaw.  As General Robert reminded us, we are not laws unto ourselves - Where there is no law, but every man does what is right in his own eyes, there is the least of real liberty.

[Guest Nancy N.]

But