Bylaws

[Guest Larry S]

With Bi-laws, they are to be read three times. than moved to except with first and second motions. Discussion.

 to follow with voting.  So now the third meeting its not on the agenda. Ask about it they say (the bi-laws committee) we are tabling it till next meeting as the chair of the committee is gone this evening. Nothing was placed as a motion to table in the minutes. They just passed over it. Than it was brought up in the next meeting. no copies for any one to see. I was told you have to request a copy. My question is this the proper way to move Bi-laws forward.

Thanks, Larry S  

[Bruce Lages]

Virtually none of that is proper under Robert's Rules. What, exactly, do your current bylaws say about the method for amending them?

[Tim Wynn]

29 minutes ago, Guest Larry S said:

My question is this the proper way to move Bi-laws forward. 

Bylaws can only be amended in accordance with the process for bylaw amendment prescribed in the bylaws (or higher governing document). Check to see what the bylaws say about their amendment.

 

[Tim Wynn]

35 minutes ago, Guest Larry S said:

With Bi-laws, they are to be read three times. than moved to except with first and second motions. Discussion.

Where does this come from? This is not from Robert's Rules of Order.

36 minutes ago, Guest Larry S said:

So now the third meeting its not on the agenda. Ask about it they say (the bi-laws committee) we are tabling it till next meeting as the chair of the committee is gone this evening

Items of business do not have to be on an agenda. Ordinarily, A committee does not have the authority to dispose of the assembly's motions. 

 

40 minutes ago, Guest Larry S said:

Nothing was placed as a motion to table in the minutes. They just passed over it

The motion to Lay on the Table (sometimes referred to as "Table") is applied to a pending motion. It sounds as though the motion was never pending.

42 minutes ago, Guest Larry S said:

Than it was brought up in the next meeting. no copies for any one to see. I was told you have to request a copy.

"When any paper is laid before the assembly for action, it is a right of every member that it be read once; and if there is any debate or amendment, that it be read again before members are asked to vote on it." - RONR (11th ed.), p. 299, ll. 4-8

[Steven Britton]

3 hours ago, Tim Wynn said:

Bylaws can only be amended in accordance with the process for bylaw amendment prescribed in the bylaws (or higher governing document). Check to see what the bylaws say about their amendment.

 

I agree with Tim Wynn's answer (and welcome him back) except for the phrase " only can be." Further expanding on his explanation,  RONR,  p. 52,9 ll. 1 - 13, 11th edition, further states: 

If the bylaws are silent regarding their own amendment, …. "Special requirements for this motion's adoption should be specified in the bylaws, and they should always include at least notice and a two-thirds vote, which (with a vote of a majority of the entire membership as an allowable alternative) are the requirements for its adoption if such specification in the bylaws is neglected (see pp. 580–82)."

 

 

[Tim Wynn]

16 minutes ago, Steven Britton said:

I agree with Tim Wynn's answer (and welcome him back) except for the phrase " only can be."

 

 Certainly bylaws cannot be amended in discord with the process for bylaw amendment prescribed in the bylaws (or higher governing document)? 🙂 I would consider the rules of RONR for amending bylaws that are silent on bylaw amendment to be in accord with bylaws that are silent on their amendment.

[Josh Martin]

4 hours ago, Guest Larry S said:

With Bi-laws, they are to be read three times. than moved to except with first and second motions. Discussion.

 to follow with voting.  So now the third meeting its not on the agenda. Ask about it they say (the bi-laws committee) we are tabling it till next meeting as the chair of the committee is gone this evening. Nothing was placed as a motion to table in the minutes. They just passed over it. Than it was brought up in the next meeting. no copies for any one to see. I was told you have to request a copy. My question is this the proper way to move Bi-laws forward.

I concur with my colleagues and would add that there appears to be confusion regarding the proper use of the motion to Lay on the Table. See FAQ #12.

The bylaws committee, of course, has no authority to postpone or table the motion. The assembly itself could have decided to postpone the motion due to the absence of the bylaws committee chairman, but was under no obligation to do so.

Additionally, it is not required, strictly speaking, to provide copies of the proposed bylaw amendments, but this is generally desirable because if such copies are not provided, the amendments must be read in their entirety. (They still must be read in their entirety if a member demands it, even if copies are provided, but members may be willing to forego the reading if they have copies.) Providing copies only upon request, in my view, is not sufficient - in such a case, the amendments still must be read.

[Steven Britton]

5 hours ago, Tim Wynn said:

 Certainly bylaws cannot be amended in discord with the process for bylaw amendment prescribed in the bylaws (or higher governing document)? 🙂 I would consider the rules of RONR for amending bylaws that are silent on bylaw amendment to be in accord with bylaws that are silent on their amendment.

 

Certainly, if the bylaws prescribe a method for their own amendment, as they should. Myself, as a classically trained musician, I always tried to avoid dis-chord.

[Tim Wynn]

2 minutes ago, Steven Britton said:

 

Myself, as a classically trained musician, I always tried to avoid dis-chord.

😂 Heard that.

[Steven Britton]

7 minutes ago, Tim Wynn said:

😂 Heard that.

I believe we're in harmony now on this particular answer.

 

[Benjamin Geiger]

In the absence of provisions in the bylaws for their own amendment, would the normal fnord rules for the motion to Amend Something Previously Adopted apply?

[Joshua Katz]

1 hour ago, Benjamin Geiger said:

In the absence of provisions in the bylaws for their own amendment, would the normal fnord rules for the motion to Amend Something Previously Adopted apply?

Well, the default rules in RONR for amending the bylaws would apply if the bylaws are silent on it. Those rules are a variation on ASPA, but require notice AND 2/3 vote, or a majority vote of the entire membership.

[Gary c Tesser]

On 6/26/2018 at 2:23 PM, Tim Wynn said:

 Certainly bylaws cannot be amended in discord with the process for bylaw amendment prescribed in the bylaws (or higher governing document)? 🙂 I would consider the rules of RONR for amending bylaws that are silent on bylaw amendment to be in accord with bylaws that are silent on their amendment.

 

On 6/26/2018 at 7:53 PM, Steven Britton said:

 

Certainly, if the bylaws prescribe a method for their own amendment, as they should. Myself, as a classically trained musician, I always tried to avoid dis-chord.

 

On 6/26/2018 at 7:56 PM, Tim Wynn said:

😂 Heard that.

 

On 6/26/2018 at 8:05 PM, Steven Britton said:

I believe we're in harmony now on this particular answer.

 

 

11 hours ago, Benjamin Geiger said:

In the absence of provisions in the bylaws for their own amendment, would the normal fnord rules for the motion to Amend Something Previously Adopted apply?

Adroitly orchestrated, men.

[Tim Wynn]

4 hours ago, Gary c Tesser said:

Adroitly orchestrated, men.

Thanks, maestro.

[Benjamin Geiger]

On 6/27/2018 at 8:11 PM, Joshua Katz said:

Well, the default rules in RONR for amending the bylaws would apply if the bylaws are silent on it. Those rules are a variation on ASPA, but require notice AND 2/3 vote, or a majority vote of the entire membership.

Ah, I stand corrected.

[Benjamin Geiger]

On 6/28/2018 at 6:03 AM, Gary c Tesser said:

Adroitly orchestrated, men.

I'm glad we could... illuminate matters.