Removing the Parliamentarian

[Tomm]

Our Annual General Membership meeting is chaired by the president of the board. The boards parliamentarian who is not a member of the organization also presides.

The general Membership is not happy with the board president so is the following do-able?

A Member makes a motion to Suspend the Rules and replace the Chair (in accordance with 62:12 and footnote 5) and names another Member to chair the meeting.  The motion receives a "second", is not debatable because it's a motion to Suspend the Rules, and is voted on and it passes.

Now, can the new Chair ask that the Parliamentarian leave the meeting? The Parliamentarian has proven not to be a friend of the General Membership and the Parliamentarian is not a member of the organization! The Annual Membership Meeting is only open to Members of the organization.

[Gary Novosielski]

I think it's likely that it would be in order, but there's probably no need to do so, since the new chair pro-tem is not obligated to ask for, receive, or follow any advice from the parliamentarian.  The chair can eject non-members without a vote of the assembly for breaches of decorum, but it would be a strange Parliamentarian indeed who would do that.

[Richard Brown]

On 8/30/2022 at 6:47 PM, Tomm said:

the Parliamentarian is not a member of the organization! The Annual Membership Meeting is only open to Members of the organization.

Is this by custom or is there an actual rude to that effect? Are any non-members permitted in the meeting? Hotel staff? The audiovisual crew?

Agreeing with Mr. Novosielski,  I would think that there has to be a rule or at least a motion that only members of the society are permitted in the meeting hall.  I believe a motion to exclude one or more persons, even by name, would be in order although rather unusual. I agree with Mr. Novosielski that the chair would not have the authority to order the parliamentarian to leave the meeting hall unless the parliamentarian is causing a disturbance or there is a rule or motion in place that  specifically excludes nonmembers (or perhaps just the parliamentarian ) from the meeting.

[Drake Savory]

I know of one organization whose bylaws require a parliamentarian at their Annual Meeting so in that case the Parliamentarian cannot be removed, merely replaced.

[Weldon Merritt]

On 8/30/2022 at 7:36 PM, Drake Savory said:

I know of one organization whose bylaws require a parliamentarian at their Annual Meeting so in that case the Parliamentarian cannot be removed, merely replaced.

Yes, but there is no rule that requires the chair to pay attention to anything the parliamentarian says. Or at least it would be quite strange if there were.

[Atul Kapur]

On 8/30/2022 at 9:36 PM, Drake Savory said:

I know of one organization whose bylaws require a parliamentarian at their Annual Meeting so in that case the Parliamentarian cannot be removed, merely replaced.

That sounds like a rule in the nature of a rule of order and could, therefore, be suspended.

Edited August 31, 2022 at 03:43 AM by Atul Kapur

[Weldon Merritt]

On 8/30/2022 at 9:43 PM, Atul Kapur said:

That sounds like a rule in the nature of a rule of order and could, therefore, be suspended.

I hadn't thought of that, but I think you're right.

[Josh Martin]

On 8/30/2022 at 6:47 PM, Tomm said:

Our Annual General Membership meeting is chaired by the president of the board. The boards parliamentarian who is not a member of the organization also presides.

Please clarify what is meant by the statement that the parliamentarian "also presides."

On 8/30/2022 at 6:47 PM, Tomm said:

The general Membership is not happy with the board president so is the following do-able?

A Member makes a motion to Suspend the Rules and replace the Chair (in accordance with 62:12 and footnote 5) and names another Member to chair the meeting.  The motion receives a "second", is not debatable because it's a motion to Suspend the Rules, and is voted on and it passes.

Yes.

On 8/30/2022 at 6:47 PM, Tomm said:

Now, can the new Chair ask that the Parliamentarian leave the meeting? The Parliamentarian has proven not to be a friend of the General Membership and the Parliamentarian is not a member of the organization! The Annual Membership Meeting is only open to Members of the organization.

I don't think the chair can order this on his own initiative, unless the parliamentarian becomes disruptive. But the membership could certainly order this, by majority vote.

On 8/30/2022 at 8:36 PM, Drake Savory said:

I know of one organization whose bylaws require a parliamentarian at their Annual Meeting so in that case the Parliamentarian cannot be removed, merely replaced.

Such a rule is, in my experience, rather unusual, and I am not aware of any such rule for Tomm's organization.

[Tomm]

On 8/31/2022 at 10:44 AM, Josh Martin said:

Please clarify what is meant by the statement that the parliamentarian "also presides."

All I mean is the parliamentarian takes a seat next to the Chair. The parliamentarian is not a member of the organization but only there providing a service.

Interesting comment by Mr. Brown!

On 8/30/2022 at 6:03 PM, Richard Brown said:

Is this by custom or is there an actual rule to that effect? Are any non-members permitted in the meeting? Hotel staff? The audiovisual crew?

Actually there are employee's of the corporation there providing audiovisual services, but this is a senior, over 55 community and those employee's who are not actual Members don't have the right to vote!

[Richard Brown]

On 8/31/2022 at 2:36 PM, Tomm said:

those employee's who are not actual Members don't have the right to vote!

Well, if the parliamentarian is not a member I’m sure he does not have the right to vote either, does he? My concern was that you seemed to be saying that The parliamentarian has no right to be there because he is not a member and that  nonmembers are not allowed in the meeting. So, I was wondering about non-members of the sort I mentioned, i.e., hotel staff and audiovisual people. If you are saying the Parliamentarian should not be permitted to be in the room because he is not a member, then what about all those other non-members who are also in the room? 

I agree with Mr. Martin that the assembly by majority vote could probably order the parliamentarian to leave, but I don’t think the chair has the authority to do this on his own unless the parliamentarian is creating a disturbance.

Edited to add:  BTW, The parliamentarian usually sits on the dais beside the presiding officer. That does not mean he also presides. To the contrary, the parliamentarian very rarely presides unless he has been retained specifically to do so.
 

Edited August 31, 2022 at 07:54 PM by Richard Brown
Added last paragraph

[Weldon Merritt]

On 8/30/2022 at 7:36 PM, Drake Savory said:

I know of one organization whose bylaws require a parliamentarian at their Annual Meeting so in that case the Parliamentarian cannot be removed, merely replaced.

On 8/31/2022 at 11:44 AM, Josh Martin said:

Such a rule is, in my experience, rather unusual, and I am not aware of any such rule for Tomm's organization.

I'm not sure it's that unusual. I have run across served a couple of organizations that have such a rule. But I agree that nothing we have been told shows that any such rule applies to Tomm's organization.